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+--- Thread: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? (/Thread-Phantom-sound-boxed-dipole-etc)
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Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - MountainGuy - 15-May-2015
Curious.
With the unconventional shape of the Phantom, does it sound like a boxed speaker or per chance more like a dipole? Does it sound like a point source even for nearfield listening? Or something else?
How is the soundstage width/height/depth?
Thanks!
MtnGuy
Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - mirekti - 16-May-2015
Interesting question. I'd like to hear the answer to it as well.
I also still wonder why there is no more Hi-Fi reviews on Phantoms. Wherever I look at it's always an article about the specs.
...or none of the hi-fi crowd (except on this forum) consider them worth evaluating.
RE: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - f1eng - 16-May-2015
It behaves like a point source, and having no corners has less diffraction error than conventional speakers.
An accurate reproduction of height is not possible with a stereo pair of speakers, and if you get one it will be an artefact due to imperfect speaker performance.
2 speakers = 2 dimensions accurately reproducible, and these are width and depth, both of which are truly exceptional on the Phantoms.
RE: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - EvPa - 16-May-2015
(16-May-2015, 18:20)mirekti Wrote: I also still wonder why there is no more Hi-Fi reviews on Phantoms.
It's probably because, despite being on sale since mid-February, the Phantoms' "large-scale" release is only planned for next month.
RE: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - fgueho - 16-May-2015
There are some reviews. Real reviews. Not a lot, but you can find some (in english, french or german).
And you have some owners reviews on this forum.
RE: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - mirekti - 17-May-2015
Yeah, but as I wrote already most of them end with something like this:
"Does Devialet’s Phantom system sound as good as a more traditional system at its price level? That is the question which interests me; if I get an opportunity to try it out I will be sure to report back." http://gadgets.itwriting.com/3271-devialets-phantom-audio-system-on-show-in-barcelona.html
I am looking for some comprehensive review like those from let's say theabsolutesound.com, soundandvision.com and similar.
RE: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - fgueho - 17-May-2015
You can use google translate on this one:
https://curved.de/news/devialet-vs-audiophysics-duell-der-soundgiganten-231686
RE: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - Divasson - 17-May-2015
(16-May-2015, 19:18)f1eng Wrote: It behaves like a point source, and having no corners has less diffraction error than conventional speakers.
An accurate reproduction of height is not possible with a stereo pair of speakers, and if you get one it will be an artefact due to imperfect speaker performance.
2 speakers = 2 dimensions accurately reproducible, and these are width and depth, both of which are truly exceptional on the Phantoms.
My engineering/math background tells me the same thing, and yet... I clearly hear things on top of my head on some records. I am using Gallo Strada loudspeakers, that have a tweeter that behaves like omnidirectional, and two ball-shaped 4" drivers. In Extreme's "Warheads", there is an airplane flying from front left to back right, on top of you - clearly audible (and yes, there is an improvement with firmware 8.0.0, also in height). In Chesky's 5.1 Surround Show, stereo CD layer, track 6, "The Storm", the thunders are clearly heard overhead. There is no mistaking it!
In fact, there is a series of articles in The Absolute Sound from Charles Zeilig, Ph.D., titled "New Methods for Quantifying Sonic Performance" (TAS 246, 248 and 249), where he sets a system playing a piece with some voices heard over your head (LIM K2HD 040, UD, track 5, "Misa Criolla"), and sets up a system whereby he measures the height of the apparent voice in inches measured on a given plane, with the help of an assistant, for different combinations of equipment, cables, codecs and other tweaks. Results, according to him, are repeatable and measurable.
RE: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - Gremlin - 17-May-2015
And stereo does mean three-dimensional. I used to have a few test tracks that had a scratching sound (as far as I remember) ascending from each speaker in turn and then arcing over and between the two.
RE: Phantom sound - boxed, dipole etc? - f1eng - 17-May-2015
By what mechanism could sound possibly be outside the plane containing your ears and the speakers with only 2 speakers (or even more if all in that plane?
I understand that artefacts from speaker layout or reflections of tables and so forth could give the impression of height, and even expectation bias could, it is likely your brain would expect an aeroplane to be above for example. If it isn't this I would like to know what it is.
I don't believe in magic.