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+--- Thread: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 (/Thread-Magico-S3-200-vs-250-vs-400)
Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - nicoludio - 12-Jul-2014
Hello all, glad to have found this forum for all things Devialet without the occasional negativity and cynicism on other sites.
I am considering the Magico S3, and was wondering as to which Devialet would make a better match:
1. new 200; or
2. used D-Premier upgraded to the 250 (which can be found at a price similar to a new 200)?
Comparisons online between the D200/D250 are inconclusive and, I suppose, speaker dependent. Both are apparently the same internally with only the different casework in the 250 offering, possibly, better heatsinking and thus drive capability.
If I do go for the refurbished 250, it is would be with the view of not having to upgrade to the 800 in future. If I go for the new 200, I would probably be tempted to move on to the 400 at some stage.
At the end of the day, is the 250 much better than the 200 for the Magico S3?
Or, would the 250 be good enough such that an upgrade to the 400 will not result in significant improvements?
I understand that BjornWiman, who uses Magico Q3s, has found the monos better than the equivalent stereos (200 vs 400 and 250 vs 800) but I wonder if he had the opportunity to compare the 250 to 400 as well.
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - BjornWiman - 12-Jul-2014
Hello "nfnc",
Unfortunately we did not performed the comparison you asked for. But it seem to me that Devialet believes that the 400 combo is even better than the 250 since the 250 is not promoted in the same manner after the introduction of the 400.
Best regards
BjornWiman
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - darthsteph - 13-Jul-2014
And a dealer told me that Devialet thinks that 2 x 400 is better than a 800…!
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - Confused - 13-Jul-2014
(13-Jul-2014, 00:18)darthsteph Wrote: And a dealer told me that Devialet thinks that 2 x 400 is better than a 800…!
Did he explain why exactly! He may have a point, in that for the customer it's a much better price. Otherwise, slightly bonkers!
I can only comment on my own experience, which was a back to back listen of the 170 vs the 240, but even this is loosing relevance now that the 170 has grown up to become a 200. With KEF Blades the 240 was clearly superior compared to the 170. This was not a small difference, in areas such as bass definition the difference was stark. I am not 100% clear what the difference between the 200 / 250 is, but there are some clues out there. The 250 case provides superior cooling, some say that there are power supply differences. Some folk suspect that the additional cooling allows changes to the way the power supply is configured or controlled electronically, which accounts to the 250 sounding better, but perhaps mainly in cases where the speakers are a more difficult load. To be honest, from what I have read, no one seams to know for sure. (Although there must be a boffin at Devialet who knows many secrets)
As to how the 250 sounds vs the 400? Many opinions out there, but not much in the way of hard facts.
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - GuillaumeB - 13-Jul-2014
(13-Jul-2014, 09:15)Confused Wrote:(13-Jul-2014, 00:18)darthsteph Wrote: And a dealer told me that Devialet thinks that 2 x 400 is better than a 800…!
Did he explain why exactly! He may have a point, in that for the customer it's a much better price. Otherwise, slightly bonkers!
I can only comment on my own experience, which was a back to back listen of the 170 vs the 240, but even this is loosing relevance now that the 170 has grown up to become a 200. With KEF Blades the 240 was clearly superior compared to the 170. This was not a small difference, in areas such as bass definition the difference was stark. I am not 100% clear what the difference between the 200 / 250 is, but there are some clues out there. The 250 case provides superior cooling, some say that there are power supply differences. Some folk suspect that the additional cooling allows changes to the way the power supply is configured or controlled electronically, which accounts to the 250 sounding better, but perhaps mainly in cases where the speakers are a more difficult load. To be honest, from what I have read, no one seams to know for sure. (Although there must be a boffin at Devialet who knows many secrets)
As to how the 250 sounds vs the 400? Many opinions out there, but not much in the way of hard facts.
Sounds to me as though someone needs to get down to the Oxford Audio event on the 16th July with a list of questions! I believe Matthieu Pernot from Devialet will be there. Unfortunately I can't make it.
Guillaume
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - Unclemonty - 19-Jul-2014
I'm using a D Premier with Magico S3, seems like a great combination.
When you find out which Devialet is the best match, please let me know! Looks like Devialet may have extended the D Premier upgrade programme a while longer so a D250 could be on the cards if it's worthwhile. Cheers!
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - Confused - 20-Jul-2014
I did discuss the differences of the 200 / 250 / 400 with Mathieu at the Oxford Audio event. He confirmed what many have said previously, that the 200 & the 250 are identical electronically. This is only part of the story though. The 250's case is actually quite a sophisticated part of the amplifier, and dramatically improves rapid cooling of components. Because of this, the way the power supply is set up, software wise, is different between the two. This perhaps offers an explanation why the 250 may better with some speakers. Mathieu did make a comment that the 200 is at the limit, whereas the 250 is not, this point was not perused, but it perhaps offers a glimpse as to why two 250's become an 800, rather than two 200 a 400. Mathieu did say that the 400 is nominally superior to a 250, this is due to the dual mono format halving the distortion. So for those starting from scratch today, the choice of the 400 vs the 250 maybe comes down to how strong the desire is to upgrade to the 800 one day. For me, as someone who bought the 240 before the 200 / 400 arrived, obviously I never had this choice. If I did have the choice this decision would needed to be made after an audition, so I may never know. I can't say I'm too unhappy though, it's not like I've been listening to the 250 and thinking that the distortion is a bit too high.
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - ozthepoz - 23-Jul-2014
(13-Jul-2014, 09:15)Confused Wrote:(13-Jul-2014, 00:18)darthsteph Wrote: And a dealer told me that Devialet thinks that 2 x 400 is better than a 800…!
I can only comment on my own experience, which was a back to back listen of the 170 vs the 240, but even this is loosing relevance now that the 170 has grown up to become a 200. With KEF Blades the 240 was clearly superior compared to the 170. This was not a small difference, in areas such as bass definition the difference was stark. I am not 100% clear what the difference between the 200 / 250 is, but there are some clues out there. The 250 case provides superior cooling, some say that there are power supply differences. Some folk suspect that the additional cooling allows changes to the way the power supply is configured or controlled electronically, which accounts to the 250 sounding better, but perhaps mainly in cases where the speakers are a more difficult load. To be honest, from what I have read, no one seams to know for sure. (Although there must be a boffin at Devialet who knows many secrets)
I agree entirely. I demoed a 170 and a D-Premier at home for a couple of weeks, both driving Martin Logan Vantage speakers. The D-Premier was significantly better in terms of imaging, control and lower end definition. The 170 was OK, but the improvement when I switched to the D-Prem seemed like more than just increased power.
Obviously it depends on room, speakers, music and ears, but for me, the decision was an easy one.
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - Confused - 24-Jul-2014
New text I spotted on the Devialet website:
Successor to the iconic Devialet D-Premier, the Devialet 250 is protected by a high-capacity, heat-diffusing chassis, wrought from a single piece of gently curved, hand-polished metal.
So there you have it!
RE: Magico S3 - 200 vs 250 vs 400 - IanG-UK - 28-Jul-2014
(20-Jul-2014, 21:47)Confused Wrote: I did discuss the differences of the 200 / 250 / 400 with Mathieu at the Oxford Audio event. He confirmed what many have said previously, that the 200 & the 250 are identical electronically. This is only part of the story though. The 250's case is actually quite a sophisticated part of the amplifier, and dramatically improves rapid cooling of components. Because of this, the way the power supply is set up, software wise, is different between the two. This perhaps offers an explanation why the 250 may better with some speakers. Mathieu did make a comment that the 200 is at the limit, whereas the 250 is not, this point was not perused, but it perhaps offers a glimpse as to why two 250's become an 800, rather than two 200 a 400. Mathieu did say that the 400 is nominally superior to a 250, this is due to the dual mono format halving the distortion. So for those starting from scratch today, the choice of the 400 vs the 250 maybe comes down to how strong the desire is to upgrade to the 800 one day. For me, as someone who bought the 240 before the 200 / 400 arrived, obviously I never had this choice. If I did have the choice this decision would needed to be made after an audition, so I may never know. I can't say I'm too unhappy though, it's not like I've been listening to the 250 and thinking that the distortion is a bit too high.
That is an extremely useful post and the first time I have heard a definite explanation as to the 200 v 250 differences which are electrically the same but clearly differ substantially in casework and price.
Mathieu is a very bright guy and always extremely helpful - his visits to OAC have been great.