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Cheaper with SAM vs. more expensive without?
#21
(28-Nov-2014, 11:04)GuillaumeB Wrote: What source are you going to use with the Magtech?

Guillaume

The dealer I'm supposed to be borrowing the Magtech from seems utterly chaotic, and I haven't received it yet.

For the purposes of this demo I'm going to go PC via USB into an Audiolab M-DAC. "A lowly M-DAC!", I hear you cry: well, yes, but this is the souped up model, modded by the great John Westlake himself. It's altogether better than the off-the-shelf model.

But if I do decide on the Magtech, I'll want to consider alternatives.

I now have a 200 Companion on loan and am running the full 400 as I type this. The sonic character of the 400 seems a bit more 3-dimensional: more contours, more depth of field, so to speak. The mid-range and bass also seem a bit richer at low volumes. Having said that, it's not a huge difference, and whether it's worth £5K, well ...

Matt

Sonos Connect (W4S) > DSpeaker Antimode 2.0 > Sanders Magtech > Martin Logan Montis
Sonos Connect (W4S) > Devialet 200 > Vivid V1.5
Silver Phantoms (just the two)
London
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#22
(28-Nov-2014, 17:08)Jwg1749 Wrote:
(28-Nov-2014, 11:04)GuillaumeB Wrote: What source are you going to use with the Magtech?

Guillaume

The dealer I'm supposed to be borrowing the Magtech from seems utterly chaotic, and I haven't received it yet.

For the purposes of this demo I'm going to go PC via USB into an Audiolab M-DAC. "A lowly M-DAC!", I hear you cry: well, yes, but this is the souped up model, modded by the great John Westlake himself. It's altogether better than the off-the-shelf model.

But if I do decide on the Magtech, I'll want to consider alternatives.

I now have a 200 Companion on loan and am running the full 400 as I type this. The sonic character of the 400 seems a bit more 3-dimensional: more contours, more depth of field, so to speak. The mid-range and bass also seem a bit richer at low volumes. Having said that, it's not a huge difference, and whether it's worth £5K, well ...

Matt

Interesting... I believe Vincent Brient of totaldac was taught by John Westlake on the audio test and measurement side.

Could you not use the Devialet's pre-out to feed the Magtech? I suppose that would really help you evaluate what the Magtech amp is bringing to the party. Level playing field and all that.

I doubt whether adding an extra Devialet will result in sound that is twice as good, but to some of us even a 10 or 15% improvement is worth it! Personally I never found the 240 was quite powerful enough (with Wilson speakers) and adding another unit definitely added something rather alluring to the fluidity/musicality of the Devialet sound.

Guillaume
Industry disclosure: UK distributor for Shunyata Research

220 PRO, totaldac d1 server with additional external power supply, totaldac d1-seven, Echole PSU for Totaldac, Wilson Audio Sasha 2, Shunyata Research cables, Shunyata Hydra Alpha A10 + DPC-6 v3, Various Entreq ground boxes and cables, Entreq Athena level 3 rack, 2 X SOtM sNH-10G with sCLK-EX + 10MHz Master Clock input + sPS-500 PSU, i5 sonicTransporter w/ 1TB SSD

UK
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#23
(28-Nov-2014, 17:42)GuillaumeB Wrote: Interesting... I believe Vincent Brient of totaldac was taught by John Westlake on the audio test and measurement side.

Could you not use the Devialet's pre-out to feed the Magtech? I suppose that would really help you evaluate what the Magtech amp is bringing to the party. Level playing field and all that.

I doubt whether adding an extra Devialet will result in sound that is twice as good, but to some of us even a 10 or 15% improvement is worth it! Personally I never found the 240 was quite powerful enough (with Wilson speakers) and adding another unit definitely added something rather alluring to the fluidity/musicality of the Devialet sound.

Guillaume

It did occur to me to use the Dev's pre-outs, and I might give it a try.

The M-DAC upgrade project is fascinating. The next step will be dual mono DACs and upgraded circuits (due in a couple of months). After that JW says he's going to add an ADC and room correction. The aim is an high quality DAC that's also a box of audio tools. A DSPeaker on steroids, I guess. He's also designing a V-FET monobloc amp that I'm sorely tempted by. It uses a 5W Class A output amp and current-dumping circuit a la Quad.

I'm going to run the 400 all weekend and make a judgement next week. Hopefully by then this ruddy Magtech will have turned up. Angry

Matt

Sonos Connect (W4S) > DSpeaker Antimode 2.0 > Sanders Magtech > Martin Logan Montis
Sonos Connect (W4S) > Devialet 200 > Vivid V1.5
Silver Phantoms (just the two)
London
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#24
I did a lot of listening today with KEF Blades and SAM. Now the Blades are big speakers that don't really need a bass boost, but there were a few sections of music I listened to that sounded totally amazing, quite stunning. I tried the same sections without SAM, they sounded kind of the same, but ordinary. There was some almost surreal 3D definition that had vanished. I think there is more to SAM than just a bass boost, like the old "loudness" button on 70's music centres. The point being, if you have the choice, then yes, try to find speakers you can love that have SAM, it can provide that little bit of audio magic that we all crave. I have had SAM for about 3 months now, and I am still finding stuff that delights. It's not all joyous though, with flat bass down to 20 something hz, sometimes you hear things in the recording that are really annoying, like vocal microphone puffs, or remastering efforts to boost bass in old recordings, where amplified and equalised bass conjured out of almost nothing that existed on the original master tape are reproduced with shamefaced inducing accuracy and detail. If you like it worts and all, but stunning when the recording is stunning, with the odd moment of utter amazement, then SAM should be in the mix. If you want everything pleasant, then perhaps not. Although get you can always turn the SAM percentage down, get the phase correction, without the sometimes embarrassingly revealing ultra low bass. It's all good if you really want to hear what's possible together with what's bad.

The bad stuff can be bad but the good stuff can be so good I sometimes wonder if the folk who made the original recording and listened to it in the actual studio fully realised what they had created.
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