Mains power and conditioning

[GuillaumeB]

Hi guys at Confused's suggestion I've created a new thread so that we can all share our experiences with mains power and power conditioning/regenerating. Do any of you have dedicated spurs for your hi-fi? Do you have a ring main (ring circuit) or do you have a dedicated circuit for each hi-fi unit. What about consumer units?

Do you think these things make a difference? Please tell us what you think and share your tips!

Guillaume

[f1eng]

I do have a dedicated ring main for my hifi, though I did it for convenience reasons since perhaps any interference on the mains would be the same on all ring mains, since they are all connected together.
I have had my old Goldmund system plugged into a Goldmund distribution filter called an AC-Curator which, following on what I have learned here, I will try with the 800 when it is returned.

[f1eng]

I have just looked and I have been using a MIT Z-strip when I wasn't using the AC-Curator, so in truth I have never listened to a Devialet amp with no mains filtering at all.
Sorry!
Answering a point on the spawning thread I imagine the extent to which the interference reduces with distance will dependant on the installation's overall capacitance and inductance. It it is simply a low resistance mains supply there would be no reason why it would.
This means any loss will dependant on the behind the wall wiring, junction boxes and so forth.

I believe spur systems break UK regulations, but one could always make a single socket "ring main" by running a double cable from fusebox to socket.

I actually put in two separate ring mains when I had my listening room built. So I can choose to put the hifi on one, the other or bits on both. I haven't messed about with this much though.

[Rufus McDufus]

Spurs (or rather radials) direct from the consumer unit I believe are fine, but true spurs (off a ring main) are limited in that only one is allowed per ring main circuit and there's a limit to the number of sockets allowed on that spur. The electrician who installed mine told me spurs are becoming more common in place of ring mains, which were largely a workaround for something I can't remember! Might've been because it was method of achieving higher current ratings with thinner wire back when thicker wire was less easy to get hold of.
Some people seem to prefer ring mains to radials for hi-fi. I don't think there's a lot in it.

The wiring regulations (currently 17th edition) are irritatingly vague in places. For instance my hi-fi circuits (4 radials) are all TT-earthed - I have a separate consumer unit for hi-fi which is connected only to a dedicated earth rod. About 50% of electricians seem to think this is bad and 50% think it's perfectly OK due to the regulations being so vague! So long as everything is clearly labelled as such, they seem to be happy. It's all certified anyhow.

I'll list what I have - dedicated consumer unit connected via Henley block to incoming supply. 4 radials off that of which 2 are 6mm twin and earth and 2 are 10mm. The 6mm is quite considerably better despite me thinking 10mm would obviously be superior as it's bigger! The 10mm radials are a bit dull and lifeless.
I have a 3.6m earth rod in the garden (3x 1.2m sections). I don't get a great impedance reading off this (about 50 Ohm) but it still sounds better than when it's all connected to the regular PME earth. I've gone to this length as it's densely housed where I am and quite a bit of industry as well so it's not a brilliant power supply. I'm close to the substation too and regularly get close or bang-on the max permitted 253V supply.

In addition I've got an Airlink balanced power supply which I'm currently not using, plus Blue Circle Audio Sillycone filters. These are from Canada and are quite nutty. They're passive filters a bit like the Russ Andrews wall-wart ones but beefed up considerably. To be honest they don't seem to do a huge amount and I'm using one on the NAS and computer bits at the moment, and not directly on hi-fi bits. A drawback with them is touching the plug by mistake when unplugging them, as some large capacitors inside unload themselves through you!
I've just bought an Entreq CleanUs which seems to do good things... It filters the negative and earth leads and I'm liking it.

I've tried inline filters or regenerators in the past such as PS Audio (P3 & P5) and various others and they've just done nothing for me. It seems initially impressive but over time I feel the dynamics are a bit flat. I really wanted to like them because it sounds like a good idea.

[IanG-UK]

Take a look at this which covers a noise sniffer and a Devialet and the PS Audio PPP.

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/bluehorizon/2.html

Interestingly the PPP comes out well but the P10 (part of the replacement series) fares not too well.

[GuillaumeB]

Take a look at this which covers a noise sniffer and a Devialet and the PS Audio PPP.

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/bluehorizon/2.html

Interestingly the PPP comes out well but the P10 (part of the replacement series) fares not too well.

That's really interesting Ian, thanks for sharing.

The trouble with these noise sniffers is that we don't really know exactly what they're measuring plus there is the issue of whether whatever it is actually measuring really matters to the Devialet... having said that I do think it's a good indication of the magnitude of mains noise generated by the Devialet's SMPS, whether its common mode mode, differential etc.

I did notice that the Devialet D-Premier according to your article does not seem to be that noisy... I wonder if with the latest generation of Devialets this has changed? The earlier Devialet white paper (claiming a very quiet SMPS) I think referred to the D-Premier.

As I said earlier using the AudioPrism device the Devialets (200 and 250) were off the chart!

Guillaume

[Rufus McDufus]

I'm not sure the Audioprism is a sophisticated device - it does look like something from Practical Electronics circa 1975! This Blue Horizon one looks a lot spiffier at any rate.

[GuillaumeB]

I'm not sure the Audioprism is a sophisticated device - it does look like something from Practical Electronics circa 1975! This Blue Horizon one looks a lot spiffier at any rate.

I actually wouldn't mind getting one of those devices!

Guillaume

[Confused]

I did go to a dealer event once. The system they used was basically one I had auditioned previously, with a Devialet 240 doing amplifier duties. However, they had gone "all in" for the event, adding very expensive mains cables (so large that the Dev's rear cover needed to removed), 5k's worth of Chord Sarum speaker cables, plus a mains conditioner. I'd gone along to see what difference all this good stuff would make. (although I could think of better ways to spend 5k than on cables) The strange thing was that I though it actually sounded significantly worse than I had heard previously, with standard mains cables and speaker cables at maybe about a fifth of the price of the Sarum's. The dealer suggested that this might be something to do with the mains conditioner, in some way holding back the amplifier. From what I know, this makes sense. People have different views regarding cables, but to think something like Sarum cables would make things worse seams absurd to me. But could a mains conditioner, perhaps of an inappropriate design for what the component connected to it demands, make things worse? Quite possible I would have thought.

[GuillaumeB]

I did go to a dealer event once. The system they used was basically one I had auditioned previously, with a Devialet 240 doing amplifier duties. However, they had gone "all in" for the event, adding very expensive mains cables (so large that the Dev's rear cover needed to removed), 5k's worth of Chord Sarum speaker cables, plus a mains conditioner. I'd gone along to see what difference all this good stuff would make. (although I could think of better ways to spend 5k than on cables) The strange thing was that I though it actually sounded significantly worse than I had heard previously, with standard mains cables and speaker cables at maybe about a fifth of the price of the Sarum's. The dealer suggested that this might be something to do with the mains conditioner, in some way holding back the amplifier. From what I know, this makes sense. People have different views regarding cables, but to think something like Sarum cables would make things worse seams absurd to me. But could a mains conditioner, perhaps of an inappropriate design for what the component connected to it demands, make things worse? Quite possible I would have thought.

I can assure you that Sarum speaker cables do not sound bad with the Devialet! I have them here...

Guillaume