Brightness update

[Womaz]

Just looked at this and would ruin the speaker maybe as seems to suggest it's hard to remove once you put it on.

[Womaz]

Ok i am now looking at some bass trap and acoustic panels as a solution. Not really prepared to hang them from my ceiling though so would be placed on the walls.

I was thinking about a few pictures anyway so these wont be an issue aesthetically as you can chose your own colours and as I like the minimalistic look I find them quite appealing. Risk is though that they dont work so buying blind here.

Also may demo some Tellerium Q blue diamond speaker cable, as this is supposed to have a mellower sound. My gut feeling on speaker cable though is that it will only offer a subtle change. I think I need more than a subtle change.

[ogs]

"A perhaps crazy sounding tweak/test could be surrounding the tweeters of the 23 with a layer of foam. So simply cut out a hole the size of the diapfragm from a square piece of foam and stick it to the speaker. It's a bit like Wilson does, it'll focus the highs more towards the listener."

Re Antoine's suggestion above.

Russ Andrews actually markets, what he calls Focus Rings to achieve the same result - at a cost of course  . See here:  http://www.russandrews.com/focus-rings/.

I have not tried them myself, but they seem to be well reviewed. A relatively small outlay to try perhaps.
David

Surely not  
However at the cost it may be worth a look. Will spoil the look of the speaker though. I have contacted an acoustic company too so looking at what they come back with

I support Antoine's suggestion with diffraction damping around the tweeter. Focus rings from Russ Andrews, as linked by brit, will work fine. The web site says ".. without speaker grills". I've used similar damping with grills for years. If you normally use your speakers with grills, keep doing that and hide the Focus rings. Take a look at speakers from Avalon. This kind of damping is part of their design and playback with grills on is mandatory.

[alandbush]

Ok i am now looking at some bass trap and acoustic panels as a solution. Not really prepared to hang them from my ceiling though so would be placed on the walls.

I was thinking about a few pictures anyway so these wont be an issue aesthetically as you can chose your own colours and as I like the minimalistic look I find them quite appealing. Risk is though that they dont work so buying blind here.

Also may demo some Tellerium Q blue diamond speaker cable, as this is supposed to have a mellower sound. My gut feeling on speaker cable though is that it will only offer a subtle change. I think I need more than a subtle change.

Pardon me, but I cannot help think of you as a drowning man desperately reaching out for anything to stay afloat.

Change speakers, change speaker cable, add bass traps, acoustic panels, rugs, etc. and ALL with no idea if they will help.

Can I suggest that you take a little time and determine what it is that you consider to be 'bright'.  Perhaps also persuade friends etc. to offer their opinions.

How about starting with the following IRN interactive frequency chart

It suggests, as an example, that >6kHz provides brightness/crispness and that too little can be perceived as dull/flat.  Too much can produce sibilance and/or brittleness.  Sound familiar?

The chart lists instruments etc. that occupy that frequency range and may help you provide more useful information to the forum.  Listen to those recordings that cause issues and determine what irks you about them.  Let us know, maybe we would agree that that recording is 'poor' or not.

Provided with more specific detail the more august forum members may be able to offer advice based on their experiences.

[alandbush]

As a follow-up, and if you are adventurous   , you could generate and download sine tone .wav files for playback on your system.
You can do this from the AudioCheck website.

[Womaz]

Its too late I am under water

I have tried to explain but will try again.
I have looked at the diagram and I reckon its the 4 to 6khz range I have problem with. The biggest offender for me is sibilance. Voices sound like a hissing snake on certain words.
I have been testing using certain tracks so will try and outline what I dont like about each track, although a lot of them are very forward in their nature but thats why i use these to test.

Beatles - Hey Jude .....first few lines when he sings .......hissing sound on the Ss and Ts.

Tini Tempah Miami to Ibiza......his voice sounds sharp and then when the music kicks in....way too bright

The Maccabees - Marks to Prove it.....worst offender of all. I actually struggle to listen to this track at all now. The cymbals etc kick in after about a minute and its dreadful

Oasis - Supersonic ......cymbals just too bright.....tinny.....hissing

Birdy - Skinny Love, beautiful voice until about a minute in and then she sings " told you to be patient told you to be " ...sibilance and sounds like a hissing snake

Kasey Chambers - These Pines --- starts fine but then her voice after about 30 seconds is just piercing.

I could name more but its the same issues. I can tame it, treble control, but it feels as if the voices then disappear into the background a bit. I like them to stand out. Like i said above I think i like the forward lively sound but I need to tame the brightness/sibilance a bit now.

Its not all music. The Beck album Morning Phase sounds sublime. Full beautiful sound and bags of detail.

It could partly be my hearing I have tinnitus and do have a constant high pitched ring in them , but had this for years and the brightness only really been an issue over last few weeks.

You are right I am clutching at straws as I do not understand all of the technicalities of all this. Thats why i come on here.
But room acoustics definitely leave a lot to be desired so this is being given preference right now. My dealer also thinks he can solve it with a different speaker cable, but at over £700 into a pair of 23s, that cost £2400.....for me that seems overkill.

All comments welcome

[Womaz]

As a follow-up, and if you are adventurous   , you could generate and download sine tone .wav files for playback on your system.
You can do this from the AudioCheck website.

i have done this....but I have no idea what I am supposed to do now that I have done so

[Womaz]

Just to add I listen to these on my headphones too and the brightness and sibilance is still there but at a level I can still enjoy.

A part of me thinks that all the components I have are just not forgiving at all. Maybe this is the compromise you have to make as your gear gets better.

[alandbush]

The listed tracks have helped me understand what you are hearing.  A previous system of mine performed in a similar way, although usually above a certain volume.  The issue was removed when I added an EQ box, although at the time I was attempting to improve the bass! But the flatter frequency range must have helped.
I now have Phantoms and none of the tracks cause me any problems, although I can understand how some might (see comments below).  Of course, some users suggest that the Phantoms' highs are 'poor' so maybe I am not in a position to judge.  

I still apply EQ and, time permitting, I'll see if I can provoke the brightness issues by tweaking the highs.


Tini Tempah Miami to Ibiza......his voice sounds sharp and then when the music kicks in....way too bright

nothing in this track suggests there should be an issue

The Maccabees - Marks to Prove it.....worst offender of all. I actually struggle to listen to this track at all now. The cymbals etc kick in after about a minute and its dreadful

this track appears very compressed in comparison to the others so is surprising it causes an issue

Oasis - Supersonic ......cymbals just too bright.....tinny.....hissing

yes, I understand how they could be a problem

Birdy - Skinny Love, beautiful voice until about a minute in and then she sings " told you to be patient told you to be " ...sibilance and sounds like a hissing snake

yes, again, I understand

Kasey Chambers - These Pines --- starts fine but then her voice after about 30 seconds is just piercing.

very definitely yes to this being a problem

[alandbush]

As a follow-up, and if you are adventurous   , you could generate and download sine tone .wav files for playback on your system.
You can do this from the AudioCheck website.

i have done this....but I have no idea what I am supposed to do now that I have done so  

The files can be moved to your NAS or Melco and should be treated as tracks.  Depending on how those servers work then you may have to add various ID3 tags (album, artist, title etc.) for them to be identified.  Otherwise, using the Folder view of your control point should find them.

Then simply play them and perhaps you may identify the frequency(ies) causing the issues.