Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Integrating 440 with Cinema
#1
Happy New Year Guys!

I do hope someone has some pearls of wisdom that can help me with an integration issue.

Equipment for my new listening/ entertainments room:

440 Pro
Triangle Deltas for Hifi mainly
Triangle Delta Centre Speaker (for Cinema)
SVS SB-2000 Sub (both Hifi & Cinema)
Kef R Dipoles (Surround)
Kef R100s (Rear)
Kef in-ceiling Ci200 Speakers (4)
Anthem MRX 1120 Receiver

OK, so I integrate the two front Triangles using the Anthem front left/right Pre-outs linked to the 440 using line-in and by-pass settings - Done
The centre Triangle is driven directly from the Anthem as is all but the Subwoofer.

The Subwoofer is currently driven by the 440 for Hifi.

The problems:

1. there is a marked difference in the 'loudness' of the Triangle fronts when driven by the anthem in comparison with anything directly driven, but I am assuming that there must be some sort of 'gain' slider in the input config for the 'line In' on the 440?????

2. I am somewhat at a loss as to how to utilise the Subwoofer as it is directly wired to the 440, so how to pass LFE from Anthem to Sub via the 440? Huh

3. The Subwoofer will switch to standby mode if there is no 'play' activity from the 440 after say 5 mins, but does not 'wake up' when you recommence music playing?
I cannot remember this being a problem with the 400 before it was updated to 440?

I am aware that there may be some 'trigger' input on the Sub, but since I am already using a trigger wire betwix the two units (cos I have input connections utilised on both), I am not sure what to do?

4. For some reason, even though you 'blank out' any inputs you dont need in the 440 config, they STILL seem to be in the list of inputs you need to navigate when switching sources?? V Annoying! Angry This did not happen with the 400 Expert!

Thoughts on the issues above would be gratefully received! Cool

Cheers

Keith
Fairford UK area - Devialet 440, Aurender Streamer- Linked to QNAP NAS 453mini - Triangle Signature Deltas, Van Damme Professional Blue Series Studio Grade 2 x 4.0 mm cables, Moon Neo 260D DC Transport, Dell notebook Client linked both ethernet & wifi.
Reply
#2
1) There is a gain slider for line in configured for bypass but you may find increasing it too much will induce hiss. You can also increase the level of your fronts to match your center and rears using your Athem. A happy medium will need to be found. Heat can also be a concern with not enough current coming in from the Anthem.
2) Configure Anthem to not have a subwoofer and to pass full range signal to your fronts. The Devialet will them take over cross over duties.
3) Not sure
4) Sounds like your config isn't actually loading, the default config is, which might explain some of the other issues you are experiencing. Have you named your config and see if the amp displays that name when booting up?
Roon->RoonBridge->Air 3.02RC->Devialet 220 Pro->Transparent Super->Wilson Audio Sabrinas w/ Shunyata Denali, Rega RP8, Apheta 2, Rega Aria


Reply
#3
(10-Jan-2017, 15:10)Dr Tone Wrote: 1) There is a gain slider for line in configured for bypass but you may find increasing it too much will induce hiss.  You can also increase the level of your fronts to match your center and rears using your Athem.  A happy medium will need to be found.  Heat can also be a concern with not enough current coming in from the Anthem.
2) Configure Anthem to not have a subwoofer and to pass full range signal to your fronts.  The Devialet will them take over cross over duties.
3) Not sure
4) Sounds like your config isn't actually loading, the default config is, which might explain some of the other issues you are experiencing.  Have you named your config and see if the amp displays that name when booting up?

Thanks for your thoughts...

Bit concerned about the comment " you may find increasing it too much will induce hiss" and "Heat can also be a concern with not enough current coming in from the Anthem"
Sounds like a bit of a 'Cludge' though? Yes there is a db gain on the Anthem, but not a lot, and not enough on its own to overcome the issue. There is also another factor here, and I am not sure of the answer, in that if you up the gain on the Anthem manually for the fronts significantly, would this create an issue when using Anthems room correction/ balancing software when setting up the room, i.e. is there a danger of the fronts running out of automatic adjustment of needed!

Although not recommended, I did think of avoiding all this fuss, and just wiring the Anthem directly to the fronts also, knowing that I would only be using Cinema or HiFi separately, ie. the other would be switched off! - but I am guessing this could mess up stuff if both accidentally were on! Pity there was not a manual hi-fi grade speaker switch I could employ! ...but then there is the problem of the SUB!!!!

Gawd!
Fairford UK area - Devialet 440, Aurender Streamer- Linked to QNAP NAS 453mini - Triangle Signature Deltas, Van Damme Professional Blue Series Studio Grade 2 x 4.0 mm cables, Moon Neo 260D DC Transport, Dell notebook Client linked both ethernet & wifi.
Reply
#4
(10-Jan-2017, 15:48)teddlesdee Wrote: Bit concerned about the comment " you may find increasing it too much will induce hiss" and "Heat can also be a concern with not enough current coming in from the Anthem"
Sounds like a bit of a 'Cludge' though? Yes there is a db gain on the Anthem, but not a lot, and not enough on its own to overcome the issue. There is also another factor here, and I am not sure of the answer, in that if you up the gain on the Anthem manually for the fronts significantly, would this create an issue when using Anthems room correction/ balancing software when setting up the room, i.e. is there a danger of the fronts running out of automatic adjustment of needed!

Although not recommended, I did think of avoiding all this fuss, and just wiring the Anthem directly to the fronts also, knowing that I would only be using Cinema or HiFi separately, ie. the other would be switched off! - but I am guessing this could mess up stuff if both accidentally were on! Pity there was not a manual hi-fi grade speaker switch I could employ! ...but then there is the problem of the SUB!!!!

Gawd!

Lowering the voltage setting on that analog input tells the devialet to use a little more power in the output to get the volume up because it's not receiving as much signal as it needs.  The lower you go  on that setting the harder the power amps is working and will run hotter as to be expected.

If you don't lower the voltage setting in the Devialet and tell the anthem to crank the level up for the mains the signal to noise ratio lowers and could cause hiss.  Your Anthem might be better than my Pioneer Elite was in this regard.

It's a balancing act. You'll want to watch input meter on the Devialet it will tell you if it's near clipping the A/D converter or not.

Edit: I forgot the setting is in db when doing bypass mode unlike a normal analog input. You can take my voltage advise and apply the same logic in reverse I guess.
Roon->RoonBridge->Air 3.02RC->Devialet 220 Pro->Transparent Super->Wilson Audio Sabrinas w/ Shunyata Denali, Rega RP8, Apheta 2, Rega Aria


Reply
#5
This might be a similar issue?

http://devialetchat.com/showthread.php?t...ss-through

It is perhaps worth noting that with my cheap and cheerful Yamaha surround amp, the volume level in pass-through mode is fine. So I think your proposed set up should work fine, there is no reason why this should be an issue with the Anthem, the output levels are fairly standard I think.
1000 Pro - KEF Blade - microRendu - Mutec MC3+USB - Pro-Ject Signature 12
Reply
#6
OK Guys, very useful...

However, not being a 'whizz' at this stuff I have a few more question on this, if you don't mind?

You mention making changes on the Dev side, and in the configurator I see under the line-in settings RMS (set at 2 at the mo), and another slider for pass through gain (I suppose) set at -15db. Are any of these the ones - the latter seems reasonable?

cheers

Keith
Fairford UK area - Devialet 440, Aurender Streamer- Linked to QNAP NAS 453mini - Triangle Signature Deltas, Van Damme Professional Blue Series Studio Grade 2 x 4.0 mm cables, Moon Neo 260D DC Transport, Dell notebook Client linked both ethernet & wifi.
Reply
#7
(10-Jan-2017, 16:41)teddlesdee Wrote: OK Guys, very useful...

However, not being a 'whizz' at this stuff I have a few more question on this, if you don't mind?

You mention making changes on the Dev side, and in the configurator I see under the line-in settings RMS (set at 2 at the mo), and another slider for pass through gain (I suppose) set at -15db. Are any of these the ones - the latter seems reasonable?

cheers

Keith

Yah, it's my bad.  I forgot its a db slider when in bypass mode.

Change that slider from -15 towards 0 until you are happy with the level.  Try -10, -5 and even 0. Ignore my hiss comments you might not even encounter that issue.

You can get it close with the Devialet, getting it perfect will still require using the Anthem's calibration utilities after the fact.
Roon->RoonBridge->Air 3.02RC->Devialet 220 Pro->Transparent Super->Wilson Audio Sabrinas w/ Shunyata Denali, Rega RP8, Apheta 2, Rega Aria


Reply
#8
(10-Jan-2017, 16:41)teddlesdee Wrote: OK Guys, very useful...

However, not being a 'whizz' at this stuff I have a few more question on this, if you don't mind?

You mention making changes on the Dev side, and in the configurator I see under the line-in settings RMS (set at 2 at the mo), and another slider for pass through gain (I suppose) set at -15db. Are any of these the ones - the latter seems reasonable?

cheers

Keith

Pass-through set to -15dB would tend to make your front speakers relatively quiet.  This is of course exactly what you stated the issue was in your first post, so I think this looks like the issue.  If you try this at 0dB you should get the volume level roughly right, and then fine tune on the Anthem.
1000 Pro - KEF Blade - microRendu - Mutec MC3+USB - Pro-Ject Signature 12
Reply
#9
Well done guys,

The speaker level - Fixed! Thanks a lot for confirming... 2db did it! Cool

I still do have a problem with the Sub though!

The sub works fine for all inputs other than the Line-in or so it seems. I looked at all the settings, but could not see anything obvious...
When driving the sub from the Anthem, the Sub is totally silent!

The next job was to see where we go with the Anthem settings!
Well, turned Sub off in their menus, got rid of the front crossover level.... but nothing!

Don't know what to try next?

Any ideas?

cheers

Keith
Fairford UK area - Devialet 440, Aurender Streamer- Linked to QNAP NAS 453mini - Triangle Signature Deltas, Van Damme Professional Blue Series Studio Grade 2 x 4.0 mm cables, Moon Neo 260D DC Transport, Dell notebook Client linked both ethernet & wifi.
Reply
#10
I assume you have the preout and cross over all configured as you need it in the Devialet for the sub woofer?

Have you enabled sub/pre out on the Anthem input channel along with the bypass setting? It's the only setting I can think of that would make the sub not working in that input only.
Roon->RoonBridge->Air 3.02RC->Devialet 220 Pro->Transparent Super->Wilson Audio Sabrinas w/ Shunyata Denali, Rega RP8, Apheta 2, Rega Aria


Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)