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Phantom II 95dB Stereo
#1
Hi all

After some deep digging around on this forum and various other sources, I am seriously considering getting a pair of Phantom II 95dB and a pair of the legs to go with them.

I am planning to use them for home cinema setup as well as music. 

The living room is relatively small (about 24 square meters) and I don't plan to annoy my neighbours.

I appreciate that I am asking on a Devialet owners forum but I've looked into KEF LSX wireless II + Kube 8b as an alternative option (found BW Formation Duo beyond budget, KEF LS50 Wireless II was another but I guess would need a subwoofer for cinema purposes?).

Any suggestions on other options of a similar cost or personal experience of using these on stereo setup would be greatly appreciated!

I am based in the UK and it's been hit and miss with arranging a proper demo - besides, it will probably sound different in my own living room and I am not sure if it's worth the potential return hassle. 

Thanks for all your help in advance!

ps. Any deals that people know of these would also be great!

Thank you all
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#2
The main problem you'll have with Phantom II is latency (lipsync) For music playback this will not be a problem, but with video you will have to delay the picture to be in sync with sound. For the LSX a digital input is only a negligible 5ms (milliseconds) delayed while the LSX analog input has just under 50ms. Phantom II default is 190ms adjustable down to 60ms. There is also a optical direct mode for the Phantom II where you may achieve lower latency (I'm not sure about this), but wifi is disabled in this mode and you can only stream via optical.
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Devialetless!
Roon, ROCK/Audiolense XO/Music on NAS/EtherRegen/Pi4+RoPieeeXL/USPCB/ISORegen/USPCB/Sound Devices USBPre2/Tannoy GOLD 8
250 Pro CI, MicroRendu(1.4), Mutec MC-3+USB
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#3
Thank you for your reply ogs.

With the optical direct mode - has anyone had a chance to measure this or tweak this?
I am planning to use the Optoma CinemaX P2 which seems to have a maximum of -50 to +50 ms range for optical output delay..
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#4
There is a whole thread here at DC on Phantom II optical direct. If + or - 50ms on the CinemaX means delaying picture relative to sound it may work.
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Devialetless!
Roon, ROCK/Audiolense XO/Music on NAS/EtherRegen/Pi4+RoPieeeXL/USPCB/ISORegen/USPCB/Sound Devices USBPre2/Tannoy GOLD 8
250 Pro CI, MicroRendu(1.4), Mutec MC-3+USB
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#5
(21-Sep-2021, 12:19)ogs Wrote: There is a whole thread here at DC on Phantom II optical direct. If + or - 50ms on the CinemaX means delaying picture relative to sound it may work.

Yea I went through them and remember seeing someone mention the difference between modes being 176ms - does that mean the optical direct is probably about 24ms-ish (assuming default of 190ms)?

Pulled the trigger today on a pair of reactor 600 but haven't got the projectors yet so maybe this is a bit of a gamble  Dodgy
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#6
User @ofrappier says in the end of that thread that Devialet is working on a setting in the app that allows for very low latency in optical direct (like Phantom I). I hope that is not promise ware .
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Devialetless!
Roon, ROCK/Audiolense XO/Music on NAS/EtherRegen/Pi4+RoPieeeXL/USPCB/ISORegen/USPCB/Sound Devices USBPre2/Tannoy GOLD 8
250 Pro CI, MicroRendu(1.4), Mutec MC-3+USB
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#7
Received these today (matte black) - Quick thoughts:
1) Very nice build
2) Linking them to wifi was easy
3) Connection stability between the 2 speakers over wifi is unreliable - when playing music via airplay, the speakers would stutter with one side worse than the other
4) Issue above disappears when I use a 3.5mm to 3.5mm jack between the two speakers.
5) I think I may need to go for Bluetooth connection between these speakers and the projector (Optoma CinemaX P2) in the future as the port for miniTOSLINK would be taken up to stablise the connection between speakers. Could the speakers connect to each other by ethernet?
6) I have tried to airplay video over mobile and sound over the speakers, there is no discernable audio or video lag - fingers crossed when it goes over to the projector...
7) I have tried to compare between night-mode on and off - I think having the night mode on seems to give better clarity/imaging?

Of course, the sound: These beat the LSX with a Kube10 subwoofer (probably a little bit cheaper overall). I don't think these better the LS50 wireless II in treble, mid and imaging but competitive in terms of bass (but LS50WII cost more).

Going to test them a few more days before deciding if to return them or not.
If keeping I will probably need to buy a stand for them (currently using foam bases).

Will be interesting to know what everyone else's thoughts on the above.
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#8
I think using an ethernet cable to link the two will give best stability. Your description of sound vs KEF speakers seems spot on.
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Devialetless!
Roon, ROCK/Audiolense XO/Music on NAS/EtherRegen/Pi4+RoPieeeXL/USPCB/ISORegen/USPCB/Sound Devices USBPre2/Tannoy GOLD 8
250 Pro CI, MicroRendu(1.4), Mutec MC-3+USB
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#9
(22-Sep-2021, 20:40)philip78 Wrote: Received these today (matte black) - Quick thoughts:
1) Very nice build
2) Linking them to wifi was easy
3) Connection stability between the 2 speakers over wifi is unreliable - when playing music via airplay, the speakers would stutter with one side worse than the other
4) Issue above disappears when I use a 3.5mm to 3.5mm jack between the two speakers.
5) I think I may need to go for Bluetooth connection between these speakers and the projector (Optoma CinemaX P2) in the future as the port for miniTOSLINK would be taken up to stablise the connection between speakers. Could the speakers connect to each other by ethernet?
6) I have tried to airplay video over mobile and sound over the speakers, there is no discernable audio or video lag - fingers crossed when it goes over to the projector...
7) I have tried to compare between night-mode on and off - I think having the night mode on seems to give better clarity/imaging?

Of course, the sound: These beat the LSX with a Kube10 subwoofer (probably a little bit cheaper overall). I don't think these better the LS50 wireless II in treble, mid and imaging but competitive in terms of bass (but LS50WII cost more).

Going to test them a few more days before deciding if to return them or not.
If keeping I will probably need to buy a stand for them (currently using foam bases).

Will be interesting to know what everyone else's thoughts on the above.

Finally, someone who can give me a long awaited answer - how do they compare with the LSX + Kube 10. Actually I wanted a Kube 8 with the LSX.
Before deciding if you will return them or not play with them a little longer, try positioning them in more than one place, and also free the toslink ports and give them proper source.
From my experience ... I had them firstly on two chairs and stream via bluetooth, before finally mounting them on the wall (using gekos) and giving them signal via optical.
It is a night / day difference.
I have them linked to eachother with an ethernet cable, leaving me both opticals free.
I just use one port - from tv's optical out, so you will have another one available to use with your projector, instead of bluetooth.
Now, about the latency. No need to worry at all. If you set it to minimum from the app (60 ms I think) there is no visible delay between audio and video. I have my tv set to : optical + internal speakers. On optical I have the Phantoms. So, I am able to verify the syncronization also with my ears, not only with my eyes, I don't hear the Phantoms having any delay compared with the sound generated by the tv's speakers.

By the way ... if let's say someday I will decide that I want to add a subwoofer to my Phantoms, what are the means of connecting it ?
As I said - I have the Phantoms connected to eachother by ethernet cable, and I give them signal from the Tv via optical cable.
My Tv is my media player, I have a hdd connected to my tv, and some flacs on it. But mostly I'm playing from youtube or Tidal.
I love the simplicity of this setup, and the fact that I can do all from my tv's remote (except the volume - I use the phone for that), but sometimes I wonder if a small subwoofer would add some good things to this equation.
I found the Phantoms to be probably the only speakers to give me enough bass for my taste without the use of a subwoofer.
I've heard the LS50W (not LS50W2) and they are no match for the Phantoms at low frequencies.
Actually, at sub-bass frequencies I don't know anything that will match them, given their size. They go well into subwoofers territory, but they don't have the punch of a subwoofer.
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#10
Thanks @marius23mvp

I got the legs for these today. I think they are overpriced for what they are but hey.. (got them at 10% off from £149.00 each).
I think the legs have made a difference in ease of positioning therefore improved the sound (I suspect if you already have a stand, there is no sonic improvement over these).

I've now connected the two via ethernet port.

Going to use the miniTOSLINK as suggested.

I am leaning towards keeping these..
The sound is not quite as big as I would like, but neither is my wallet...

I ran these at 45% volume today and felt the room vibrating.. Don't think my neighbours will like me if I tried 70%...
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