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I have had my 120 for a year and I think I am about to give it up. I have home demoed a Naim Superuniti and enjoyed the music better than during the last year with the 120. I am wondering if this is just a question of taste or whether I have set up the 120 wrongly (though I have changed things about in every way I can think of). I would welcome ideas.

I have a Cyrus Signature transport into the 120 via Chord Signature TA coaxial. Good Tellurium Q cables lead to Spendor D7 speakers. The detail and soundstage are incredible but the system has always sounded forward, 'edgy', and while not sibilant the treble is sometimes uncomfortably sharp.

The Naim doesn't project the music from that lovely black background that the 120 creates. You don't have the fine-etched detail. But the music just seems so much more involving and listenable. 

So, is the 120 and the Spendor a bad match? Is Cyrus not right, though I have tried PC/usb and heard a similar sound? Don't mention speaker position since they have been in every inch of the room at one time or other. I have swapped cables and those I have are the best of numerous tries. Am I missing something? Do I just not 'get' the Devialet sound?

By the way, I set up the Naim for streaming in 5 minutes without the slightest issue. I have never been able to get Air working, couldn't even get the download to open (or uninstall). Streaming is not important for me, but this has not inspired confidence in the 120.
Hello,

The SuperUnitii and D120 are indeed different in sound quality. For me, the D120 was simply too superior to make the SuperUniti an option. That said, I like Naim equipment very much.

If I may say so, the Naim equipment, at least in the more modest price ranges, is a bit indistinct in the bass, and a bit veiled in the treble, so the sound difference you are suggesting is understandable. I personally, did not find the SU more listenable, but if you do, then that is completely reasonable. My experience with streaming to my Naim was exasperating for three years, and with the Devialet it has been flawless.

Just as the Naim is critical of speaker cable, so too the Devialet is sensitive. But the Tellurium Q should be quite a good match. In the same way, power cables and the quality of power at the outlet also makes a notable difference to the mid to upper frequencies. That is my experience, at least. Is your D120 new? Mine took about 60 hours to lose a bit of a metallic edge, especially in the treble. Ah, just re-read and noticed that you have had the D120 for a year, so break in is not an issue. I don't know the Cyrus or Spendor, so can't comment there. But if you just find the Naim is a better fit for your ears. then that is completely fair.

There are some other members here who have, or who had, Naim equipment and may be able to help or advise further, either on the sound character or setup.

(Rome)
(28-May-2017, 14:11)ism Wrote: [ -> ]I have had my 120 for a year and I think I am about to give it up. I have home demoed a Naim Superuniti and enjoyed the music better than during the last year with the 120. I am wondering if this is just a question of taste or whether I have set up the 120 wrongly (though I have changed things about in every way I can think of). I would welcome ideas.

I have a Cyrus Signature transport into the 120 via Chord Signature TA coaxial. Good Tellurium Q cables lead to Spendor D7 speakers. The detail and soundstage are incredible but the system has always sounded forward, 'edgy', and while not sibilant the treble is sometimes uncomfortably sharp.

The Naim doesn't project the music from that lovely black background that the 120 creates. You don't have the fine-etched detail. But the music just seems so much more involving and listenable. 

So, is the 120 and the Spendor a bad match? Is Cyrus not right, though I have tried PC/usb and heard a similar sound? Don't mention speaker position since they have been in every inch of the room at one time or other. I have swapped cables and those I have are the best of numerous tries. Am I missing something? Do I just not 'get' the Devialet sound?

By the way, I set up the Naim for streaming in 5 minutes without the slightest issue. I have never been able to get Air working, couldn't even get the download to open (or uninstall). Streaming is not important for me, but this has not inspired confidence in the 120.

Thanks for sharing your concerns. I have never thought that Devialet would sound forward or edgy so I am thinking that something is not right on your setup. From my experience the Devialet should sound detailed but very pleasant. There are actually quite many ex-Naim owners who have changed to Devialet.

There is actually a thread where an another Devialet owner was saying the sound being aggressive, forward, and sharp. It might be worth to read it through.
https://devialetchat.com/showthread.php?tid=4215

Apparently he got it resolved by just doing a new configuration from scratch (using Devialet default configuration and not changing anything on it) and loading it to his Devialet.
https://devialetchat.com/showthread.php?...2#pid61642
https://devialetchat.com/showthread.php?...0#pid61660

Have you tried this already? Smile
I have had the Spendor D7's myself on the Devialet 200 and was never completely fond of the match. After switching to the Sonus Faber's this is not an issue anymore, a very good match. I think the Spendor's are just one of the few speakers which don't match well with Devialet. At least compared to other's like Naim.

I have listened Naim myself and understand what you mean, Naim sounded more 'easy', but also more boxed in, or narrow. Also for me was the ongoing box count when you go for Naim a big issue... But in the end it all comes down to one thing: what do you like the most! And that's the way to go.
(28-May-2017, 14:11)ism Wrote: [ -> ]I have had my 120 for a year and I think I am about to give it up. I have home demoed a Naim Superuniti and enjoyed the music better than during the last year with the 120. I am wondering if this is just a question of taste or whether I have set up the 120 wrongly (though I have changed things about in every way I can think of). I would welcome ideas.

I have a Cyrus Signature transport into the 120 via Chord Signature TA coaxial. Good Tellurium Q cables lead to Spendor D7 speakers. The detail and soundstage are incredible but the system has always sounded forward, 'edgy', and while not sibilant the treble is sometimes uncomfortably sharp.

The Naim doesn't project the music from that lovely black background that the 120 creates. You don't have the fine-etched detail. But the music just seems so much more involving and listenable. 

So, is the 120 and the Spendor a bad match? Is Cyrus not right, though I have tried PC/usb and heard a similar sound? Don't mention speaker position since they have been in every inch of the room at one time or other. I have swapped cables and those I have are the best of numerous tries. Am I missing something? Do I just not 'get' the Devialet sound?

By the way, I set up the Naim for streaming in 5 minutes without the slightest issue. I have never been able to get Air working, couldn't even get the download to open (or uninstall). Streaming is not important for me, but this has not inspired confidence in the 120.

Hey ism,

where do you live? In a big city or countryside? Does the D120 sound the same all the time, meaning does it sound equal during the day vs. at night (1-3am).
Mostly if a Dxxx has this digital signature in its sound it is because of bad power quality in your home.

Second is the surface your audio parts are standing on. Avoid any kind of glas and even marble/granite give a signature to the sound that you won't like. Just try out different surfaces and you'll know what I'm speaking of.

Third, because the Dxxx are more transparent in its circuit concept and sound as e.g. Naim they are prone to induced EM-Fields from all around and a Dxxx doesn't like Jitter in the audio signal. But since your Cyrus Transport and your cables are fine it has to be something with power or/and EM-Fields.

Pull out any SMPS Power Supplies and listen again w/o them even if they are pluged in elsewhere in the room and not plugged into the power stripe of your audio. You'll hear an improvement in sound if you pull them out. It's all about EM-Fields and resonances that contaminates the sound of your audio...and unfortunately the Dxxx are more open to them than other audio.

gui
(28-May-2017, 16:37)petrik Wrote: [ -> ]
(28-May-2017, 14:11)ism Wrote: [ -> ]I have had my 120 for a year and I think I am about to give it up. I have home demoed a Naim Superuniti and enjoyed the music better than during the last year with the 120. I am wondering if this is just a question of taste or whether I have set up the 120 wrongly (though I have changed things about in every way I can think of). I would welcome ideas.

I have a Cyrus Signature transport into the 120 via Chord Signature TA coaxial. Good Tellurium Q cables lead to Spendor D7 speakers. The detail and soundstage are incredible but the system has always sounded forward, 'edgy', and while not sibilant the treble is sometimes uncomfortably sharp.

The Naim doesn't project the music from that lovely black background that the 120 creates. You don't have the fine-etched detail. But the music just seems so much more involving and listenable. 

So, is the 120 and the Spendor a bad match? Is Cyrus not right, though I have tried PC/usb and heard a similar sound? Don't mention speaker position since they have been in every inch of the room at one time or other. I have swapped cables and those I have are the best of numerous tries. Am I missing something? Do I just not 'get' the Devialet sound?

By the way, I set up the Naim for streaming in 5 minutes without the slightest issue. I have never been able to get Air working, couldn't even get the download to open (or uninstall). Streaming is not important for me, but this has not inspired confidence in the 120.

Thanks for sharing your concerns. I have never thought that Devialet would sound forward or edgy so I am thinking that something is not right on your setup. From my experience the Devialet should sound detailed but very pleasant. There are actually quite many ex-Naim owners who have changed to Devialet.

There is actually a thread where an another Devialet owner was saying the sound being aggressive, forward, and sharp. It might be worth to read it through.
https://devialetchat.com/showthread.php?tid=4215

Apparently he got it resolved by just doing a new configuration from scratch (using Devialet default configuration and not changing anything on it) and loading it to his Devialet.
https://devialetchat.com/showthread.php?...2#pid61642
https://devialetchat.com/showthread.php?...0#pid61660

Have you tried this already? Smile
Absolutely Smile .I've been feedup and was thinking at the end this is the devialet 200 signature but i was completely wrong.It has only started sounding right after i've had downloaded the first (default) devialet configuration without going to advanced at all.
BUT NOTICED ONE MORE THING AT THE TIME AS REMEMBER RIGHT (HAD AN SOME KIND OF LOADING CONFIGURATION ERROR COMES UP ON THE DISPLAY) but have restarted the devialet and all went well after that.As to help you with opinion about NAIM VS DEVIALET i've had a naim supernait (original) in the past on the same speakers and it was pleasant sounding especially on vocals, quite dynamic but grainy ,little details and weak soundstage comparing to my d200 there is NO COMPARISON -d200 is in adifferent class alltogether.Hope it helps.
Kamil
ism,

I just wanted to follow up and say that neither I, nor any of us, I hope, would try to convince you that the Devialet is the 'right' amp for you; it may not be. But I hope that you will look at all the aspects of your system before making a change. Cables, and cable arrangement, or 'cable dressing', really does seem to matter.

As I've rambled on about in other posts, getting your cables arranged neatly and away from each other really does affect the sound of the system. For me, that affect was completely critical in the higher frequencies. Changing coax cables from my modified Sonos Connect made a difference that was easily apparent. Even my wife could hear the difference, though her evaluation was simply that, 'I can play it louder now' when the better matched coax cable was in place.

If you can try your D120 on other systems, or with other sources or speakers you may be able to expose some interesting differences in various parts of the system, and get a better sonic picture of the D120 sound.

(Rome)
Thank you all very much for your responses. I am inspired to keep going!

I think it is certainly right that I need to make more fundamental changes to get a better idea of the Devialet sound. 

I have looked at the threads referred to. The speaker cable used in the unsatisfactory system was Tellurium Q, as is mine, so I will borrow some Chord Signature and see how that goes. 

I am going to move the whole system to a different room and see how that affects things. I have gone back to factory configurations, though I found that I preferred the sound quality when all inputs but the digital input for my cd were disabled. Maybe that in itself sharpened the sound too much.

I shall try some other speakers, if I can. I have already tried different equipment surfaces. I found the most natural sound on a plain wooden table which was light but firmly built. I will try some different mains cables, though I have Audioquest NRG 10 and they are the best I have come across so far.  

Thanks again for taking an interest.
Just a note that the chord signature cables are brighter sounding that tellurium q ultra blacks with bigger,stronger more pronounced bass which might not help you (my experience).
(29-May-2017, 21:13)ism Wrote: [ -> ]Thank you all very much for your responses. I am inspired to keep going!

I think it is certainly right that I need to make more fundamental changes to get a better idea of the Devialet sound. 

I have looked at the threads referred to. The speaker cable used in the unsatisfactory system was Tellurium Q, as is mine, so I will borrow some Chord Signature and see how that goes. 

I am going to move the whole system to a different room and see how that affects things. I have gone back to factory configurations, though I found that I preferred the sound quality when all inputs but the digital input for my cd were disabled. Maybe that in itself sharpened the sound too much.

I shall try some other speakers, if I can. I have already tried different equipment surfaces. I found the most natural sound on a plain wooden table which was light but firmly built. I will try some different mains cables, though I have Audioquest NRG 10 and they are the best I have come across so far.  

Thanks again for taking an interest.

I see you're on your way. Tryout different things but keep an eye on the power line quality.

If you can make it anyhow (let) install a dedicated powerline from the power distribution box in your home to your audio (a dedicated audio fuse in this box will help too). This will have the most positiv impact on cutting down digital signature in the sound of your D. Try that (if you can) before changing (expansive) power cables. You can even try a power line 'on the fly' on the floor to test if that helps the sound. But get an electrician for that unless you know what you're doing at your power distribution Idea .

gui
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