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Full Version: Why SAM don't support Lowther?
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Hi, I'm newbie here. My favourite loudspeaker is Lowther, but not found at SAM database.
Anyone can tell me the resone.


Thank in advance.
SAM will work for a speaker in a cabinet. Lowther only makes drive units. There are many cabinet drawings at the Lowther web site, but AFAIK this is all DIY. SAM could maybe work for one of these, but only for the tested combination and not as a general SAM profile published on Devialet's web. I am also unsure how well SAM would work for back loaded horn cabinets.

My speakers have a SAM profile, but they're heavily modified and very different from the retail version. The profile is therefore only useful for me and is not available on Devialet's web.
@kamikaze
For a speaker to have a SAM profile, it must be measured, and then the profile created. There are hundreds of speakers available and to get a SAM profile, either the speaker needs to go to Devialet's lab, or the mobile lab must go to where the speaker is. The last time I looked at the list of SAM'd speakers, it was.... 700? A huge number.

They have measured many current and past speaker models, but they cannot do every single speaker from every manufacturer. I'd love a profile for mine, but the serial number on my speakers is 301; not many pairs in existence. It makes sense to measure for the most popular, or numerous speaker models, even though there are many outstanding speakers that do not sell in large numbers or do not have wide distribution.

If, as @ogs says, Lowther makes drivers only, it would be especially difficult to profile a speaker as there would be no way to have a standardized cabinet.
Thank @ogs and @Damon for your detail answer.
Do we have any comparision of with and w/o SAM. Just my concern about looking for another one for SAM support or continue with SAM unsupported Lowther.
(29-Mar-2019, 08:12)kamikaze Wrote: [ -> ]Thank @ogs and @Damon for your detail answer.
Do we have any comparision of with and w/o SAM. Just my concern about looking for another one for SAM support or continue with SAM unsupported Lowther.

We all choose our speakers for lots of different reasons and I think choosing a speaker because it has a SAM profile is silly, whether or not you have a Devialet or are thinking of getting one.

When I bought my Devialet I had a pair of Dynaudio Contour 1.3 SEs. I bought them years before the first Devialet was released so SAM wasn't an issue. When I got my 130 I tried it with and without the SAM profile and found I preferred them with SAM but they sounded great with the 130 without SAM. SAM was a nice "bonus" but I would have bought the 130 whether it had SAM or not.

Some months after getting the 130 I upgraded my speakers to Focal Sopra 2s, a very different speaker with a very different interaction with my room. Once again I tried things with and without SAM. I prefer the Sopras without SAM. I suspect part of the reason may be the fact that my room is a bit on the awkward side for a speaker the size of the Sopra 2s. I can get them to work very well in the room but that bit of extra bass extension and how it loads the room may be a little bit too much. It changes the voicing of the speaker at the bottom end and while I like the extra extension, I prefer the way the low bass sounds in my room without SAM.

SAM isn't only a speaker issue, it's also a room issue because of that extra extension, and it does change the voicing of the speaker at the bottom end. If you like the way the bottom end of the speaker is voiced when SAM isn't used, you may not like it with SAM. It's a bit like whether you like milk or sugar with your coffee. There's an element of personal taste involved. SAM is not a magic bullet for making any speaker with a SAM profile better, either in every room or for every person.

If you like a speaker with Lowther drivers and you think a Devialet works well with it, then you've got a good combination for your own tastes. The fact that there isn't a SAM profile doesn't make the combination work any worse. I works the way it works and if you like that, then that's what you're looking for. If you have a Devialet and you're looking at changing speakers, try them with the Devialet and it a particular speaker has a SAM profile then try it with and without SAM but at the end of your search what you're going to buy is the speaker that sounded best with the Devialet and if that speaker is a speaker without a SAM profile are you really going to say "No, I'm not going to buy it because it doesn't have a SAM profile. I'll buy another speaker I didn't like quite as much because it has a SAM Profile."? That sounds a silly way to go about making your choice because it is a silly way to make the choice.

SAM is an option you have with some but not all speakers. If your speaker has a profile then it's a handy option to have but there's a lot of speakers like full range electrostatics, full range ribbons, and pretty well every DIY speaker  you could consider which includes a lot of speakers using Lowther drivers and there's a lot of really good speakers amongst those speakers without SAM profiles and if you really like one of those speakers with a Devialet more than you like any other speaker you've auditioned then go for it.

SAM's a nice option to have but if you find a speaker you really like, it sounds great with a Devialet, and it doesn't have a SAM profile you're not missing out on anything. You're still getting great sound and that's what you want to get.
I generally agree with David here. You won't find 'normal' speakers with the same dynamics and character as the Lowthers however, but you may of course find speakers that satisfies your taste among the SAM enabled ones. Your best bet for your Lowther speakers is to look out for a SAM lab session near you (or if you live near Paris...) and have them measured for SAM. Then you can decide for yourself if it works well or not. For SAM measurements you only need to bring one speaker. All measurements are laser near-field so room acoustics does not matter.
(29-Mar-2019, 13:13)ogs Wrote: [ -> ]I generally agree with David here. You won't find 'normal' speakers with the same dynamics and character as the Lowthers however, but you may of course find speakers that satisfies your taste among the SAM enabled ones.  Your best bet for your Lowther speakers is to look out for a SAM lab session near you (or if you live near Paris...) and have them measured for SAM. Then you can decide for yourself if it works well or not. For SAM measurements you only need to bring one speaker. All measurements are laser near-field so room acoustics does not matter.

I assume that your "generally agree" means that you disagree with my comment about the room having an effect.

I think you misunderstood what I was saying. I know that SAM profiling is done with laser measurements so room acoustics don't affect those measurements or the profile. My point is that with the profile loaded in your Devialet and the speakers playing in your room, the room does play a part in how you hear that extra bass extension. Let's say you have a speaker that is rolling off in your room at 40 Hz without SAM and you get extra extension down to 25-30 Hz. You can end up exciting, or rather exciting more strongly, a room mode below 40 Hz which wasn't an issue without SAM. 

I'm not anti-SAM, I think it's great when you like the result and, as I said, I liked the result with my Dyns but not with my Vocals. If I ever move to a bigger room I'll try SAM again and I would not be surprised if I found I ended up preferring SAM with the Focals in a bigger room just because of the way a bigger room handles low bass frequencies. All I was saying with my mention of the room when it comes to whether or not you prefer SAM is that the room has a big impact on how bass sounds and if the same speaker can deliver good bass in one room and not in another, then the same speaker with SAM engaged can also sound good in one room than another and there's no reason why that speaker may not sound better without SAM in one room and better with it in another, simply because of the impact that the room has when it comes to low bass.
(29-Mar-2019, 20:29)David A Wrote: [ -> ]I assume that your "generally agree" means that you disagree with my comment about the room having an effect.

No, I actually meant 'I agree'. Of course the room has an effect.
The part with the laser was intended as information for kamikaze in case he wanted to try to get his Lowthers SAMed.
Thank for your sharing. Many factors can take effect to the final result, SAM is one of them not always the main.
I found that the configuration file has the detail configuration for the speaker. Did anyone try to modify these parameter?
That would not work unfortunately. The Devialet config file is protected by a checksum written in the first line of the file as 'CRCxxxx'. Any manual change to a config file will invalidate the checksum and the file will not load.