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+--- Thread: Firmware 8.1 released! (/Thread-Firmware-8-1-released)
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - hahe - 17-Jun-2015
no sub in use and tried with sam on / off - agree that in my chain also sam on makes it more aggressive
at the same time when turning off I seem to loose some of the stage resolution improvements of 8.1
in the meantime also did do some initial tests with 7.3.1 and usb as source and seems this also has improved quite a lot over 7.1.1
sounds more musical / holistic than ethernet whereby it also seems some stage- and mid resolution is lost via that source
having said this with lowering sam % (without it doesn't really sound good to me) clarity seems to come back at ~20% or less
will further continue exploring this as usb would be preferable for me as air not absolute stable with high-res files although no white noise
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - Vivialet - 17-Jun-2015
the interesting thing is that the USB firmware has not changed since 7.x, it is from 3/2014. The Devialet is like a computer, whenever some processing is done (like SAM or low pass filters) it affects SQ. While SAM V1 was always reducing the top frequencies a little bit SAM V2 makes the sound more aggressive. Of course this can be speaker dependant, different profiles, different processing.
If I go back to 7.1.3 I would really miss ICM, the other new functions are not so important for me. But 8.1 without SAM was sounding very good, not sure if 7.1.3 is really that much better. If the differences are only very small I will keep 8.1.
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - hahe - 17-Jun-2015
(17-Jun-2015, 17:32)Vivialet Wrote: the interesting thing is that the USB firmware has not changed since 7.x, it is from 3/2014. The Devialet is like a computer, whenever some processing is done (like SAM or low pass filters) it affects SQ. While SAM V1 was always reducing the top frequencies a little bit SAM V2 makes the sound more aggressive. Of course this can be speaker dependant, different profiles, different processing.
If I go back to 7.1.3 I would really miss ICM, the other new functions are not so important for me. But 8.1 without SAM was sounding very good, not sure if 7.1.3 is really that much better. If the differences are only very small I will keep 8.1.
Based on your earlier response (and after an afternoon listening to 7.3.1) I was curious to compare again with 8.1 SAM Off
If SAM is turned off or alternatively on with 0%, 8.1 musical perception via USB is not so far away from 7.1.3 and still clearer
There however seems to be a quite significant difference between USB (better) and Air (more harshness) in my chain.
If USB FW has not changed as per your statement than 8.1 must better resolve this source (maybe caused by changes made in context to dsd)
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - PhilP - 17-Jun-2015
(15-Jun-2015, 10:10)NickB Wrote: That's what I said -
I can listen to music on any system and enjoy it
I choose to use a very good system to enjoy it on
But the important thing is the music not the system.
I was thinking about the sentiment expressed in your post when I was driving in my car today singing along to ... well, I won't admit what
.The systems that I've had most enjoyment from are: my original Linn Lp12/Naim 42 110/Linn Kans and my car stereo. Not that I don't really like like my current system but I don't think I really get so much pure enjoyment from it as I have had from those other systems.
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - Confused - 17-Jun-2015
(17-Jun-2015, 18:57)PhilP Wrote:Back in the 19th century we had music but no audio systems. If you wanted to listen to music you had to play it yourself, or go out to somewhere where music would be playing. Of course this would need to be fairly local, because the car had not been invented, so you would need to go on foot, horse or maybe bicycle. Today we have both music and audio systems, I find they work best in partnership. Oddly enough, I was listening to some music in the car today, and came across one track I found particularly enjoyable. When listening to this track, I did find myself thinking that I must stick it on my playlist for listening at home. If it sounds good in the car, what will it sound like on a decent system?(15-Jun-2015, 10:10)NickB Wrote: That's what I said -
I can listen to music on any system and enjoy it
I choose to use a very good system to enjoy it on
But the important thing is the music not the system.
I was thinking about the sentiment expressed in your post when I was driving in my car today singing along to ... well, I won't admit what
The systems that I've had most enjoyment from are: my original Linn Lp12/Naim 42 110/Linn Kans and my car stereo. Not that I don't really like like my current system but I don't think I really get so much pure enjoyment from it as I have had from those other systems.
It does occur to me that one of the key reasons for a forum like this to exist is so like minded users can swap information that can lead to ever greater pleasure from that synergistic combination of music and system. Why not spend a little time every now and again to make that system just that little more glorious. Although if you view is forums like this are a wast of time, and time is better spent listening to music and not worrying about all this stuff, then why not listen to music rather than posting on forums that music is more important than the system.
To be clear music is very, very, important to me. It would be hard to describe just how important, in fact. This is perhaps the reason I have spent far more money than is sensible on audio kit, and indeed the music to play on it. Having said all that, does anyone have any posts regarding firmware 8.1? I understand that SAM 2 does indeed work slightly differently with existing SAM profiles. Any observation regarding this?
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - Confused - 17-Jun-2015
I thought this might be worth sharing. A selection of tweets from the very fine people of the most excellent Oxford Audio Consultants (highly recommended dealer, I wonder if they give huge discounts to those who plug them on line). Anyway, these were sent as feedback from OAC's visit to the Phantom training session this week. (So feedback from the Devialet folk themselves) Fascinating stuff I thought, and of relevance to any existing SAM users switching to 8.1. The dynamic compression statement I found of particular interest, and I'm curious how all this will manifest itself in real world listening.
@OxfordAudio: @TheShadow1977 SAM2 is more efficient than the original algorithm. Apparently it is more accurate than SAM V.1 and better spatially
@OxfordAudio: @TheShadow1977 Your current Blade profile works exactly the same as a SAM lab profile would. Existing users should see a slight improvement
@OxfordAudio: @TheShadow1977 one last thing... Dynamic compression is now based upon signal as opposed to volume. You should find deep bass at high levels
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - NickB - 18-Jun-2015
(17-Jun-2015, 18:57)PhilP Wrote:(15-Jun-2015, 10:10)NickB Wrote: That's what I said -
I can listen to music on any system and enjoy it
I choose to use a very good system to enjoy it on
But the important thing is the music not the system.
I was thinking about the sentiment expressed in your post when I was driving in my car today singing along to ... well, I won't admit what
The systems that I've had most enjoyment from are: my original Linn Lp12/Naim 42 110/Linn Kans and my car stereo. Not that I don't really like like my current system but I don't think I really get so much pure enjoyment from it as I have had from those other systems.
I have to agree and had exactly the same system once upon a time, while not accurate the Kans were a real fun sound. Not sure though that the Sansui SR222 I had before the Linn wasn't even more fun.
Some of my best music memories are of me driving my kids around in the car all of us singing along to something playing on the admittedly rubbish car cassette player !!
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - oxfordaudio - 18-Jun-2015
Hi Confused,
Thanks for the plug, the cheque is in the post. Normal rate OK?
The dealer day was fascinating and I am deeply impressed at their forward thinking to all the features to be added over the coming years... (not sharing, I'll leave it to wild speculation...)
Valentine, who showed us how SAM lab works, was very good at explaining exactly what the 'lab measures without having to resort to crayons for us simple dealers. The 'lab plugs into the rear of a 200 or 250 and occupies both the speaker outputs and four of the digital RCA inputs. These are used to send frequency sweeps to the speakers and output data back to the 'lab to be sent to a computer. A laser vibrometer is attached via a 3.5mm input on the 'lab which measures the speed of both acceleration and deceleration of the woofer drivers given a defined power output and the driver excursion (maximum excursion is found by measuring the point that the driver no longer moves pistonically). 'Lab also measures the loudspeakers load on frequencies up to and above 200hz. Once the data has been collected the Sam program shows the speakers impedance model and phasing issues on some graphs with recommended corrections to optimise LF output and correct for phase anomalies.
The amount of vibration from the dealer's feet was enough to scew the vibrometer's results initially, so I am not surprised that initially custom SAM profiles will be done at dealer events with every care taken to minimise interaction from the room and audience.
With SAM V1, the algorithm for correction was apparently fairly inefficient and this has been improved with SAM v2, this should allow for more accurate phase correction and should explain why some have found staging performance to have improved going to FW8. With SAM v1, Dynamic compression occurred past an arbitrary level that had been set "BY EAR", I had found that with certain speakers this had seemed fairly overprotective in artificially reducing LF output with some recordings at relatively low levels. SAM v2 only restricts LF output if the desired volume with cause the LF drivers to reach or exceed the X-max of the drive unit and to my ears sounds much better than v1 with some of the speakers that I had been most disappointed by, most notably the Martin Logan Theos which had previously seemed to have had all their life sucked out by SAM.
One EXCEPTIONALLY interesting point made to us by Devialet (and one that I was fairly taken aback by) is that there is apparently no difference in how 8.1.0 and 8.0.0 process audio. The only difference in the two FW versions is in the human interface.
Hearing what's coming soon from Devialet has reassured me that they are still the David vs Goliath firm that shook everything up with D-Prem and there's some great stuff on the way.
We will be hosting two Devialet events this year for those who are interested, this isn't a shill or a hard sell (most of you have already bought your amps anyway...) The first, in July, is to launch Phantom and a second will be a SAM Lab specific event that will take place this autumn or winter where you are all welcome to bring any speakers that are not already on the list. No purchase necessary but Jon and I respond well to biscuits and beef jerky.
We fully understand that quite a few of you have lost your local dealer since the distribution changed and we'd like to help wherever we can. If you have issues with Devialet service or faults with the product, we're here to help and in most cases I feel we can get issues resolved quicker than emailing direct (he says confidently whilst tempting fate)
Alasdair at Oxford Audio
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - thumb5 - 18-Jun-2015
(18-Jun-2015, 11:43)oxfordaudio Wrote: One EXCEPTIONALLY interesting point made to us by Devialet (and one that I was fairly taken aback by) is that there is apparently no difference in how 8.1.0 and 8.0.0 process audio. The only difference in the two FW versions is in the human interface.
That's very interesting given the discussion in the 8.0/8.1 firmware update threads on this forum!
(18-Jun-2015, 11:43)oxfordaudio Wrote: We will be hosting two Devialet events this year for those who are interested, this isn't a shill or a hard sell (most of you have already bought your amps anyway...) The first, in July, is to launch Phantom and a second will be a SAM Lab specific event that will take place this autumn or winter where you are all welcome to bring any speakers that are not already on the list. No purchase necessary but Jon and I respond well to biscuits and beef jerky.
Do you have a mailing list or registration mechanism for these events? I'd be very interested in coming along to the SAM Lab event in particular, hopefully bringing along my pair of Sonus faber Guarneri Homage to get a SAM profile made...and it would be good to meet you, of course.
Ian
RE: Firmware 8.1 released! - Rufus McDufus - 18-Jun-2015
(18-Jun-2015, 11:43)oxfordaudio Wrote: One EXCEPTIONALLY interesting point made to us by Devialet (and one that I was fairly taken aback by) is that there is apparently no difference in how 8.1.0 and 8.0.0 process audio. The only difference in the two FW versions is in the human interface.That's interesting. I have to smugly admit I haven't detected any sound quality differences. Without reading the whole thread back I don't think many (or any?) others have noted any differences either?