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+--- Thread: Devialet Dante Dongle (/Thread-Devialet-Dante-Dongle)
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Devialet Dante Dongle - mak972 - 12-Oct-2017
https://www.cepro.com/article/devialet_audio_speakers_engineering_design
Is it a new product ?
RE: Devialet Dante Dongle - Pim - 12-Oct-2017
It's definitely a dongle made by Devialet. It looks to be the solution to get rid of the latency the Phantom is plagued with.
Another article tells a bit more about that.
https://www.cepro.com/article/devialet_wireless_audio_jay_z
RE: Devialet Dante Dongle - ogs - 13-Oct-2017
This will enable Phantoms to talk Dante, but it does not solve the latency issue for Phantoms as it uses the optical input of the speaker. That will require a firmware without latency. Seems they have made a dongle instead of introducing a new version of Phantom with Dante logic inside. The new streamer board for the Pro Experts has the Audinate (Dante) chip installed. I guess the next Phantom version may have this too.
Maybe Devialet will come up with a solution, a setting, to remove latency in a standard firmware? This would be much easier than having to install a custom firmware. Just speculating here, but I suppose it is possible to include code in the optical stream from the dongle that triggers a different DSP setting. Time will tell...
RE: Devialet Dante Dongle - Pim - 13-Oct-2017
I don't own a Phantom so this is a question for those who do; does the latency actually happen inside the speaker or does it come from the Dialog?
RE: Devialet Dante Dongle - ogs - 13-Oct-2017
I do not own Phantoms either, but I believe latency is in the speaker, not Dialog.
RE: Devialet Dante Dongle - Pim - 13-Oct-2017
(13-Oct-2017, 08:36)ogs Wrote: I do not own Phantoms either, but I believe latency is in the speaker, not Dialog.
Then I wonder how the dongle would work.
Devialet Dante Dongle - Krisp - 13-Oct-2017
(12-Oct-2017, 09:23)Pim van Vliet Wrote: It's definitely a dongle made by Devialet. It looks to be the solution to get rid of the latency the Phantom is plagued with.
Another article tells a bit more about that.
https://www.cepro.com/article/devialet_wireless_audio_jay_z
Having read the articles I doubt that this shortens the 160 ms latency of the Phantoms but it will bring multi room systems (even with mixed vendors) which support Dante protocol in sync.
Just my 2 ct
Krispo
RE: Devialet Dante Dongle - ogs - 13-Oct-2017
Yes, me too. As I said further up Phantom would need a special firmware (or setting in the DSP) to remove latency. Latency is enemy number one in installations like this. I think the dongle is just a workaround for the fact that Phantoms do not support Dante/Ravenna directly on it's ethernet port. I am certain Devialet regrets this now. Audio over IP is strictly ethernet by the way. No 'lifestyle' wifi in that area...
RE: Devialet Dante Dongle - Jean-Marie - 13-Oct-2017
I don’t own a Phantom either, so what follows is speculation based on reasoning:
I don’t believe that the latency is coming from the DSP treatment. What makes me stating so is that from a signal processing perspective, I don’t think that a phantom is doing anything substantially different from an expert with SAM turned on, and the latency in this case is imperceptible.
I believe that the latency in the phantom is coming from the fact that it is designed to be able to have multiple ones synchronized over the network, and if you want to be able to do it over a standard IP network, which is what a pair of phantoms + dialog are doing, you need bufffering to compensate packet delay variation, and therefore you have a latency in the 10s if not in the hundreds of milli-seconds.
Now I suspect that this buffering is occurring within the phantoms, even when a single phantom is used, because it is probably simpler to always have the same path, and that would be needed in the case of two phantoms.
If this is true, it should be possible for Devialet to have a special firmware bypassing this logic that enables networked phantoms and kind of having a direct path between the optical input and the DSP section. Such a phantom would have a similar latency as an expert.
I suspect that this is what they did in the context of that dongle.
My highly speculative two cent,
Jean-Marie
RE: Devialet Dante Dongle - Pim - 13-Oct-2017
Love your work Jean-Marie.
So the dongle will need to be used with a music player that uses Dante over a network. Assuming Dante is rock solid and doesn't need a buffer this should work. Now the question would be what do you use to play music with?
Another question is why Devialet haven't advertised the dongle yet. It must have something to do with the (un) availability of consumer Dante players.