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+--- Thread: Dac-less streamer survey! (/Thread-Dac-less-streamer-survey)
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - Jwg1749 - 28-Feb-2015
(28-Feb-2015, 14:58)IanG-UK Wrote: Hi Phil
As I said, I've a degree of cynicism about this whole issue though not enough to stop me being curious ...
Anyway, here is what Antipodes say about their dedicated ripper component in their dac-less streamers, one of which is commented on by a Devialetchat member (not that he has expressed a specific view about the ripper as far as I can see):
"Most ripping software is designed to get you a decent rip in just a few minutes. The problem is it means a lot of error correction is used. The difference between a typical rip and an excellent rip is very significant. Getting an excellent rip requires two things: the right software (not all ripping software has a 'paranoid mode' which keeps ripping till it gets the best possible result) and the right optical drive (many optical drives include additional processing which means a perfect rip is impossible). We have assembled both of these ingredients for you in Antipodes music servers, enabling you to get the best possible rips and therefore the best possible sound. Some other combination of software and optical drive may be capable of just as good a result but we have taken the uncertainty out of it for you. But you do need to appreciate that a perfect rip does take more time, and can fail with non-compliant disks (with the Redbook standard). A common non-compliance problem is when a 'hidden' track is inserted at some point in the disk, but there are other examples. You may need to rip non-compliant disks on a more forgiving, if less accurate, device."
It's fair to say that Devialet's original proposition was that Mac/iTunes for ripping (and for all the rest of the front end too) was all that one needed.
And it's also fair to say that Antipodes aren't saying that theirs is uniquely the best, simply that the typical rip is worse in some (unspecified) respect.
With modern ripping software, the quality of the optical drive's hardware is more or less irrelevant. So long as your optical drive is capable of meeting a basic standard, i.e. actually extracting some information from the disk, it can produce perfect rips. It's the software thats important, not the hardware.
The clever thing these programs (e.g. dbpoweramp or Exact Audio Copy) do is compare the results of your rips to an online database. For instance dbpoweramp will tell you whether its been able to find your CD online, and it'll even tell you how many other rips of the CD it's compared your rip to. (Indeed, most of the rippers included in streamers, if they're any good, use the same ripping software as you can buy for your PC; I'd be very surprised if the Antipodes didn't use dbpoweramp or similar.)
Let's say, for the sake of argument, that dbpoweramp finds 6 rips of your CD online, it compares the checksums, and tells you that your rip is bit-for-bit identical with these six other rips. The chances of your rip being bad are infinitesimally small.
As for software being insufficiently paranoid, I've had instances when dbpoweramp has been unhappy with a rip and has done a frame-by-frame re-rip, checking each frame individually. This can take hours. But it sure does inspire confidence.
For my own purposes, I wouldn't buy a streamer with a built-in ripper. I see no virtue in it, when my PC can do the job just as well, using the same software.
Matt
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - Jnan_devi - 28-Feb-2015
(28-Feb-2015, 14:59)GuillaumeB Wrote: Looks like I will have a Linn Akurate DS on Monday for testing. Whilst the Akurate is not a DAC-less streamer it does supposedly have an excellent digital output. It also means I will also be able to test Linn Kazoo's Tidal integration. I'll start a new thread and also post some screen shots.
Guillaume
That woudl be helpful to the forum Guillaume!. Akurate Added to the list.
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - MDB - 28-Feb-2015
I've tried my sonore rendu signature, auralic aries and Lumin (has a DAC, but BNC output). The Lumin/Lumin app was by far the best going bnc to coax. I used the Tidal ipad app to stream wirelessly to the Lumin too.
The Lumin also does great with DSD to PCM on the fly.
I would think a Lumin D1 could be very attractive for this purpose. The Lumin ipad app is excellent very stable.
I would sure like to try the totaldac server as well.
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - Womaz - 01-Mar-2015
Could the Lumin D1 not do this. Digitally connected to the Devialet??
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - MDB - 01-Mar-2015
(01-Mar-2015, 14:12)Womaz Wrote: Could the Lumin D1 not do this. Digitally connected to the Devialet??
Yes and this is EXACTLY the solution I'm looking at now. I tried my Lumin A1 into the Devialet and it worked perfectly.
I am wondering if a BNC to AES/EBU connector, like this: http://www.amazon.com/Sescom-SES-AES-EBU-2-Impedance-Transformer-Bandwidth/dp/B005TE6ZJM would be worth a shot?
Does the AES/EBU connection really sound that much better than the digital coax connection?
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - Womaz - 01-Mar-2015
Would be interested to hear how you get on if you go for the Lumin D1. I am looking to get a Dev 200 possibly but just had the bad news that my existing network player does not have a digital out. So I now have to build in a new one into my already stretched budget. The D1 is therefore something i am looking at.
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - MDB - 02-Mar-2015
(01-Mar-2015, 20:24)Womaz Wrote: Would be interested to hear how you get on if you go for the Lumin D1. I am looking to get a Dev 200 possibly but just had the bad news that my existing network player does not have a digital out. So I now have to build in a new one into my already stretched budget. The D1 is therefore something i am looking at.
The D1 is very hard to get outside of Asia from what I'm hearing. Might have to go for the T-1 instead.
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - DelaneyB - 02-Mar-2015
Surprised no mention of the Moon Mind 180 here?
Seems a good solution to me having just picked one up used with a AQ Coffee AES cable.
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - Shantanu - 12-Mar-2015
Try as much as I can, I cannot figure out how to use the Remote app on my iPhone or iPad to stream Spotify or Tidal to my Devialet. I can only stream the music that is stored on the iPhone/Pad using "My Music"
Does anyone else think that the Remote App and the "in-built streamer" are woefully inadequate?
I know that I can stream from my Macbook using AIR but since I do a lot of late lnight listening in my bedroom, having a laptop screen open is out of the question.
My questions are:
1. Am I missing a trick?
2. Am I better off getting a SONOS Connect and use a digital out from the SONOS (avoiding the inbuilt DAC) - the SONOS integrates not just a host of music streaming services but also internet radio stations and much more
3. I am also prepared to consider (better) alternatives to the Sonos provided they have (minimum) all the SONOS functionalities (integration of music streaming services and internet radio) and do not require me to use three apps on two devices simultaneously and has a digital out so that I can continue to use the Devialet DAC.
Really disappointed with the Devialet Streamer
RE: Dac-less streamer survey! - Eddye - 12-Mar-2015
1) No, the Devialet Remote app only let's you stream music files which are on your phone
2) Yes. I gather your needs aren't to stream hi-res music files, so a Sonos could work for you.
3) Start researching specs from different streamers and find out what you need and want from a streamer.