UK event with Mathieu Pernot - 17 July

[Marietto]

Voglio il SAM per Avalon Avatar  

[JonathanG]

Incidentally, is anyone else from DC planning to attend this event...?  If so, I'll look forward to meeting there.

Hi Ian, aiming to be there for the first half tomorrow, looking forward to meeting you and all others attending.

Regards,
Jonathan

[NickB]

Hi Ian

Greg and I will be there till the bitter end I expect, who is taking the reams of paper for the answers to all the questions?

Nick

[thumb5]

@JonathanG , @NickB -- will look forward to seeing you there. I'm aiming to arrive for the start, pen and paper in hand...

[Confused]

I too should be there for the start. (just about).

It”s good to see that the forum will be well represented, as well as having at least two Ian’s with notebooks. (Thumb and The General)

I look forward to seeing everyone there, and to the momentous announcement coming from Devialet.

[ssfas]

OK, here's the latest list (making the previous version obsolete):

Questions for Mathieu from the forum, in no particular order:

...

15) What is the status/schedule of the native Qobuz support that was promised (last summer)?

I had a very informative chat with Mathieu last year at KJWestOne for about half an hour. We mainly discussed the Gilels edition and he kindly put one aside and I picked it up in Paris a few weeks later, with a few other discs. I was in their main Rue Reamur store and all the staff were buzzing about a new operating system and software around about now.

On the fibre optic point, most of the 25m from my modem to my server is fibre optic. Also have an access point, but it is not on the signal path. I use a direct ethernet link from Innous to 250 Pro CI. The sound is great and faultless operation. However, Devialet Support told me NOT to do it this way, to go via the router or USB. The former is noisy, the latter loses the benefit of auto-dtection.

If I unplug the ethernet cable, Roon plays wirelessly via the router.

Can you ask why they do not recommend a direct ethernet connection, or was it bad advice?

Thanks

[markush]

Eager to hear any updates

[thumb5]

Hello all,

Just back from this afternoon's event at Oxford Audio.

Hot off the press, here are answers from this afternoon's event to the questions listed here.

Please excuse the fact that I've reorganised them so that they better follow the sequence of the discussion, while keeping the numbers the same as in the original list.  Apart from that, I've tried to capture everything Devialet said without adding my interpretation or reactions; I'll follow up with some more subjective and personal comments later.

11) What is finally the new team setup (many former people in charge of important roles left) and priority of Expert line within Devialet?

13) Devialet have committed several times to improve communication with customers.  What changes have been made in this respect and what can we expect in future?

Devialet acknowledged that they have not been focused on the Expert series for a while, and they have not made as much progress with it as they would have liked.  This is mainly because for the last couple of years their resources have been stretched to deliver the Reactor which was released last December.  They are looking to recruit more software engineers but it is not easy to find the right people.  This means it will be a while before significant resources are available to work on the Expert.

The company is strong financially.  Mathieu is still the technical mastermind behind Expert, and keeps in touch with what users want and need from the product.  In fact he sees all technically-oriented support queries about the Expert family.

Devialet also accepted that they have not been good at keeping people in touch with what they are doing or plan to do on the Expert family.  The fact is that there has not been much to say: Devialet's view is that the Expert is a mature and stable product.  There was some sympathy for that point of view.

In general, the message was that Expert is still an important part of Devialet's portfolio, and is being worked on, but we should not expect significant changes or new features in the easiy-foreseeable future.


0) What's the roadmap for the Expert series? What do Devialet have planned to use the capabilities of the CI more fully?

8) What's the status of an updated Devialet app (iphone, android, etc...) that provides all the display and full functionality of the Remote?

12) What is the expected schedule for a new and more comprehensive remote control app?

Support for Bluetooth is still planned, and there is a unified remote control app in the works along with some other enhancements "on the control side", but no timescales were mentioned.  The unified remote control app will be released for Phantom and Reactor before the Expert series.

Due to the lack of resources there is no public roadmap for further developments on the Expert series - including plans for using the CI more fully.


5) Apart from AXD, what other new capabilities/uses are planned for the Expert Pro's DSP? (For example: room correction, parametric EQ.)

There are plans to roll out more SAM profiles, with the aim of reaching a total of 1000 speaker models by the end of this year.  SAM Lab is still available so if you have speakers you'd like to get SAMed it would be worth contacting Devialet to see whether using SAM Lab would be an option.  Mathieu reminded us that SAM is not compatible with panel speakers (Magnepan, Martin Logan, etc.).

No specific new DSP features are planned.

That said, Mathieu was at pains to point out that Devialet offer services to implement custom signal processing on the Expert; in the past, people have used this to implement custom frequency response modifications, transformer output simulation and other esoteric stuff.  Indeed Mathieu said that there was "no technical limitation" so for example if you wanted to run an HAF filter (for example) on the Expert it could be done.  This is a free service that you can discuss directly with Mathieu (mp@devialet.com) if you want to.


3) What's the schedule for completing full internally-hosted configuration (this was said to be on the schedule last summer, next priority after Roon Ready support)?

There are no plans to implement a full internally-hosted configuration mechanism.  The rationale for this is firstly that it would not remove the need for the current on-line configurator (leading to more work keeping them both in track), and secondly that it would add to the burden of technical support.  Queries about networking already make up a large proportion of the support requests, and this would only add to them.


9) When is Airplay 2 coming, and any plans for Tidal native?

15) What is the status/schedule of the native Qobuz support that was promised (last summer)?

The Expert series currently supports five streaming services, the latest of which is Roon.  There are no plans to support any more (including those mentioned in the questions).  Supporting each service is a very large effort - up to 2 years.


1) What's the current status of investigating/fixing the problems with Roon (RAAT) over Gb Ethernet?

Mathieu is working on this but said it's a very tricky problem.  In fact it has not been possible to reproduce it at Devialet; the suspicion is that it may depend on the specific router being used.  Mathieu said that Devialet have had no help from Roon on this topic.  The availability of a work-around - using 100base-T - seems to be seen as acceptable.


2) What's the current status of investigating/fixing the problems (with the configurator?) that can cause high-volume distortion when SAM is enabled?

The problem is believed to be related to SAM profiles for a small number of speakers, primarily models from ELAC, where the protection mechanism is wrongly triggered.  Mathieu is working to reproduce the problem in the lab and hopes to do so by the end of this month, so as yet there is no timescale for a fix.


10) What's the current status of investigating/fixing the configurator problem whereby in dual mono configurations, some settings (balance, treble, bass) only take effect on the master, and not on the companion?

This is on the list to debug and fix.  In the meantime if you have a configuration that doesn't work as expected, Mathieu encouraged you to send him the config files which he can fix manually.


4) It would be very helpful to have a digital "effects loop" i.e. digital output from the selected input, looped through a digital processor to digital input to the ADH section. For example this would allow room correction by external hardware, in the absence of RC done by the Expert's DSP. Please comment on the possibility of implementing that.

Technically the hardware might support this in a limited set of configurations, specifically excluding dual-mono.  However there are no plans to implement it as a general feature.  If there's something specific you want to achieve from this feature, please discuss it directly with Mathieu and he may be able to help by means of a customised configuration.


6) What plans are there to support MQA directly in the Expert?

There are no plans for MQA support directly in the Expert.  Devialet see less and less call for it, and it is technically incompatible with SAM.


7) Please confirm the R/C loading for both MM and MC cartridges in the 120 and 130 (not advanced) phono stage.

14) Is there any possibility of increasing the maximum load capacitance for the advanced phono stage in MC mode (e.g. to 1000 pF)?

Mathieu clarified that there are two phono stages in the Expert series: the advanced phono stage originally introduced in the D-Premier and now (identical) in the 220 and 250, and the standard phono stage in the 140.  Although both support the same software for RIAA equalisation, etc, the standard phono stage has a slightly lower specification (S/N ratio) and does not have configurable loading.

For the standard phono stage the loading is fixed at 47 kohm with "no" capacitance.

For the advanced phono stage the loading is configurable within limits defined by the hardware.  There is no option for 1000 pF capacitive load without modifying the hardware.  That said, Mathieu would be surprised if there was ever a need for this (and suggested contacting him to discuss it if you feel it's important).

While on the topic of the phono stage, there was a discussion about the reports of noise.  To eliminate differences between speaker (and listener!) sensitivity, Mathieu asked that if you have problems with noise in the phono stage, please disconnect your cartridge and make a recording via USB as if you were digitising an album.  If you send him the recording he can do some analysis that might help to determine whether the phono stage hardware is faulty or whether there is some other problem.


Thanks very much to Mathieu and his colleagues at Devialet for gamely putting themselves in the thick of it, and to Jon, Alasdair and all at OAC for organising another informative event and being excellent hosts.

If I've missed anything, or reported incorrectly, please feel free to point it out.  As authors normally say: "all mistakes are my own".

[brit]

Hello all,

Just back from this afternoon's event at Oxford Audio.

Hot off the press, here are answers from this afternoon's event to the questions listed here.

Please excuse the fact that I've reorganised them so that they better follow the sequence of the discussion, while keeping the numbers the same as in the original list.  Apart from that, I've tried to capture everything Devialet said without adding my interpretation or reactions; I'll follow up with some more subjective and personal comments later.

11) What is finally the new team setup (many former people in charge of important roles left) and priority of Expert line within Devialet?

13) Devialet have committed several times to improve communication with customers.  What changes have been made in this respect and what can we expect in future?

Devialet acknowledged that they have not been focused on the Expert series for a while, and they have not made as much progress with it as they would have liked.  This is mainly because for the last couple of years their resources have been stretched to deliver the Reactor which was released last December.  They are looking to recruit more software engineers but it is not easy to find the right people.  This means it will be a while before significant resources are available to work on the Expert.

The company is strong financially.  Mathieu is still the technical mastermind behind Expert, and keeps in touch with what users want and need from the product.  In fact he sees all technically-oriented support queries about the Expert family.

Devialet also accepted that they have not been good at keeping people in touch with what they are doing or plan to do on the Expert family.  The fact is that there has not been much to say: Devialet's view is that the Expert is a mature and stable product.  There was some sympathy for that point of view.

In general, the message was that Expert is still an important part of Devialet's portfolio, and is being worked on, but we should not expect significant changes or new features in the easiy-foreseeable future.


0) What's the roadmap for the Expert series? What do Devialet have planned to use the capabilities of the CI more fully?

8) What's the status of an updated Devialet app (iphone, android, etc...) that provides all the display and full functionality of the Remote?

12) What is the expected schedule for a new and more comprehensive remote control app?

Support for Bluetooth is still planned, and there is a unified remote control app in the works along with some other enhancements "on the control side", but no timescales were mentioned.  The unified remote control app will be released for Phantom and Reactor before the Expert series.

Due to the lack of resources there is no public roadmap for further developments on the Expert series - including plans for using the CI more fully.


5) Apart from AXD, what other new capabilities/uses are planned for the Expert Pro's DSP? (For example: room correction, parametric EQ.)

There are plans to roll out more SAM profiles, with the aim of reaching a total of 1000 speaker models by the end of this year.  SAM Lab is still available so if you have speakers you'd like to get SAMed it would be worth contacting Devialet to see whether using SAM Lab would be an option.  Mathieu reminded us that SAM is not compatible with panel speakers (Magnepan, Martin Logan, etc.).

No specific new DSP features are planned.

That said, Mathieu was at pains to point out that Devialet offer services to implement custom signal processing on the Expert; in the past, people have used this to implement custom frequency response modifications, transformer output simulation and other esoteric stuff.  Indeed Mathieu said that there was "no technical limitation" so for example if you wanted to run an HAF filter (for example) on the Expert it could be done.  This is a free service that you can discuss directly with Mathieu (mp@devialet.com) if you want to.


3) What's the schedule for completing full internally-hosted configuration (this was said to be on the schedule last summer, next priority after Roon Ready support)?

There are no plans to implement a full internally-hosted configuration mechanism.  The rationale for this is firstly that it would not remove the need for the current on-line configurator (leading to more work keeping them both in track), and secondly that it would add to the burden of technical support.  Queries about networking already make up a large proportion of the support requests, and this would only add to them.


9) When is Airplay 2 coming, and any plans for Tidal native?

15) What is the status/schedule of the native Qobuz support that was promised (last summer)?

The Expert series currently supports five streaming services, the latest of which is Roon.  There are no plans to support any more (including those mentioned in the questions).  Supporting each service is a very large effort - up to 2 years.


1) What's the current status of investigating/fixing the problems with Roon (RAAT) over Gb Ethernet?

Mathieu is working on this but said it's a very tricky problem.  In fact it has not been possible to reproduce it at Devialet; the suspicion is that it may depend on the specific router being used.  Mathieu said that Devialet have had no help from Roon on this topic.  The availability of a work-around - using 100base-T - seems to be seen as acceptable.


2) What's the current status of investigating/fixing the problems (with the configurator?) that can cause high-volume distortion when SAM is enabled?

The problem is believed to be related to SAM profiles for a small number of speakers, primarily models from ELAC, where the protection mechanism is wrongly triggered.  Mathieu is working to reproduce the problem in the lab and hopes to do so by the end of this month, so as yet there is no timescale for a fix.


10) What's the current status of investigating/fixing the configurator problem whereby in dual mono configurations, some settings (balance, treble, bass) only take effect on the master, and not on the companion?

This is on the list to debug and fix.  In the meantime if you have a configuration that doesn't work as expected, Mathieu encouraged you to send him the config files which he can fix manually.


4) It would be very helpful to have a digital "effects loop" i.e. digital output from the selected input, looped through a digital processor to digital input to the ADH section. For example this would allow room correction by external hardware, in the absence of RC done by the Expert's DSP. Please comment on the possibility of implementing that.

Technically the hardware might support this in a limited set of configurations, specifically excluding dual-mono.  However there are no plans to implement it as a general feature.  If there's something specific you want to achieve from this feature, please discuss it directly with Mathieu and he may be able to help by means of a customised configuration.


6) What plans are there to support MQA directly in the Expert?

There are no plans for MQA support directly in the Expert.  Devialet see less and less call for it, and it is technically incompatible with SAM.


7) Please confirm the R/C loading for both MM and MC cartridges in the 120 and 130 (not advanced) phono stage.

14) Is there any possibility of increasing the maximum load capacitance for the advanced phono stage in MC mode (e.g. to 1000 pF)?

Mathieu clarified that there are two phono stages in the Expert series: the advanced phono stage originally introduced in the D-Premier and now (identical) in the 220 and 250, and the standard phono stage in the 140.  Although both support the same software for RIAA equalisation, etc, the standard phono stage has a slightly lower specification (S/N ratio) and does not have configurable loading.

For the standard phono stage the loading is fixed at 47 kohm with "no" capacitance.

For the advanced phono stage the loading is configurable within limits defined by the hardware.  There is no option for 1000 pF capacitive load without modifying the hardware.  That said, Mathieu would be surprised if there was ever a need for this (and suggested contacting him to discuss it if you feel it's important).

While on the topic of the phono stage, there was a discussion about the reports of noise.  To eliminate differences between speaker (and listener!) sensitivity, Mathieu asked that if you have problems with noise in the phono stage, please disconnect your cartridge and make a recording via USB as if you were digitising an album.  If you send him the recording he can do some analysis that might help to determine whether the phono stage hardware is faulty or whether there is some other problem.


Thanks very much to Mathieu and his colleagues at Devialet for gamely putting themselves in the thick of it, and to Jon, Alasdair and all at OAC for organising another informative event and being excellent hosts.

If I've missed anything, or reported incorrectly, please feel free to point it out.  As authors normally say: "all mistakes are my own".

As an attendee at this afternoons event at OAC, I would say that Ian’s reporting of Mathieu’s responses is a very fair summation and I would like to thank him for undertaking this role (yet again, but he does it so well   ). My own personal take on the event is a bit of a mix - whilst I appreciate that Mathieu was under certain “Company” constraints, he was open and honest in his response to the questions, it was very disappointing to hear that the Expert range was yet again taking the back seat in comparison to the Phantom/Reactor range, although those with Phantoms and Reactors should be happy(happier)?. It was a shame that the very positive approach made at last Years Munich Show, and at the OAC event last July, was not so apparent this time around.  Mathieu did reiterate that he still very much take an interest in the Expert range and did see and read all the posted technical queries sent to Devialet. He did say that there would be further firmware release but what these would be, and when they would appear, he could, or would not, say - engineering resource was real constraint.

I would also like to add my thanks to Mathieu and Jon and his team at OAC for again hosting this event and making us all welcome.

David

[David A]

Hello all,

Just back from this afternoon's event at Oxford Audio.

…

1) What's the current status of investigating/fixing the problems with Roon (RAAT) over Gb Ethernet?

Mathieu is working on this but said it's a very tricky problem.  In fact it has not been possible to reproduce it at Devialet; the suspicion is that it may depend on the specific router being used.  Mathieu said that Devialet have had no help from Roon on this topic.  The availability of a work-around - using 100base-T - seems to be seen as acceptable.
…

Ian,

Many thanks for the report, very interesting.

Re the problems with Roon RAAT, I've long suspected that differences in user networks was at least part of the problem and the router being used could certainly be an issue since that's one of the differences that can occur in our networks.  When Mathieu said that "it may depend on the specific router being used" did you get a sense of whether he was suggesting that there was one specific router which could be the problem or that they thought there may be a number of different routers involved, and did he suggest that choice of ethernet switches may also be an issue along the same lines?

Assuming that their supposition is plausible (I think it is but I'm not convinced it accounts for the whole of the problem) I can't help but think that Devialet's apparent aversion to communicating with their customers is part of the reason they're having trouble replicating it. It would be easy for them to set up a web page with a survey form asking whether or not you were having the problem and asking you to specify what router and switches you were using, and simply send out an email to all Expert owners with CI models giving them the link and asking them to respond. That would give them access to data telling them whether or niot there were any common features in the network devices people with or without the problem were using and  also make it easier to replicate the problem if there were some commonalities. Of course it would also involve a very public acknowledgement that owners are having problems.

Finally, while Mathieu said that they have had no help from Roon on the problem, Roon have said on their forums that they have been in touch with Devialet and have offered assistance. In the early days after we got the Roon Ready update a number of us were having issues with Roon not recognising our amps as certified Roon Ready products. Roon fixed that issue in a number of days so they demonstrated their commitment to solving user problems rather convincingly. It's hard to believe they haven't been as committed to ensuring we get this problem solved as well so I'm more inclined to trust Roon than Devialet regarding comments on whether Roon has tried to help.