Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
The jump from D200 to D400
#21
(08-Nov-2015, 23:41)Womaz Wrote: Yes everything I read says the Devialet and PMC speakers go really well together.
I think it's primarily my room to be honest and not a lot I can do about that , although the daughter already started looking at rugs.....women and shopping ....like men an their hifi ?

I'm sure the room is definitely a good part of it, but I have to say I've reverted to my former speakers that I hadn't yet sold, and I don't really find them 'bright' in my room. They're a bit more 'muffled' sounding and a bit warmer, and share some of the same room issues, but the treble is definitely softer and less energetic to my ears.

So perhaps the Devialet and PMC combination is just a bit too 'revealing' and/or 'honest', and really needs a well damped room to not tip things over the edge. I think I have a bit more furniture and clutter than you Womaz, but similar floor etc (although mine is an old suspended floor).

I'm not sure how you wire your speakers or if they're bi-wireable? I found one thing that did help with the Facts was using the bass inputs - this gave a fair bit extra bass - a lot more then the switches on the back of the Facts. So it helped balance things a bit but the 'hardness' of the treble was still there. I also ended up with the Van Damme hifi 4mm speaker wires, which is the brand that PMC use themselves. At the time I thought it made a difference compared to my cables with silver, but I never went back to check how I found it going the other way.

>>> 1st Place Award: Devialet, last decades most disappointing technology purchase.  <<<

Reply
#22
(09-Nov-2015, 09:09)Hifi_swlon Wrote:
(08-Nov-2015, 23:41)Womaz Wrote: Yes everything I read says the Devialet and PMC speakers go really well together.
I think it's primarily my room to be honest and not a lot I can do about that , although the daughter already started looking at rugs.....women and shopping ....like men an their hifi ?

I'm sure the room is definitely a good part of it, but I have to say I've reverted to my former speakers that I hadn't yet sold, and I don't really find them 'bright' in my room.  They're a bit more 'muffled' sounding and a bit warmer, and share some of the same room issues, but the treble is definitely softer and less energetic to my ears.  

So perhaps the Devialet and PMC combination is just a bit too 'revealing' and/or 'honest', and really needs a well damped room to not tip things over the edge.  I think I have a bit more furniture and clutter than you Womaz, but similar floor etc (although mine is an old suspended floor).

I'm not sure how you wire your speakers or if they're bi-wireable?  I found one thing that did help with the Facts was using the bass inputs - this gave a fair bit extra bass - a  lot more then the switches on the back of the Facts.  So it helped balance things a bit but the 'hardness' of the treble was still there.  I also ended up with the Van Damme hifi 4mm speaker wires, which is the brand that PMC use themselves.  At the time I thought it made a difference compared to my cables with silver, but I never went back to check how I found it going the other way.

They are bi wire able but my dealer said that it would not make any difference at all to do this , so I took that advice.
I use Tellerium Q black speaker cable which is supposed to be pretty good.

I am also starting to think it is my tinnitus as well .....just googled it and found out it can affect what you hear in music quite a bit.
I am going to try and do more headphone listening later today and see if it is in there too.

Your thoughts on PMC and Devialet are intersting as I never had the brightness with my old MF M6 amp, but then it is not a patch on the 200. Also my eras could have deteriorated too Big Grin
Devialet 200 -- Roon Nucleus-- Sonus Faber Olympica 2 -- Tellurium Q Black Speaker Cables --
Chord Qutest -- Niimbus US5 Pro Headphone amp —HifiMan HEK, Abyss 1266TC
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Reply
#23
(09-Nov-2015, 09:17)Womaz Wrote: They are bi wire able but my dealer said that it would not make any difference at all to do this , so I took that advice.
I use Tellerium Q black speaker cable which is supposed to be pretty good.

What I meant was not to bi-wire them, but as you have two sets of inputs, wire the speakers only into the bass inputs, rather than into the treble or 'cross-wired'.  This tipped the balance just (slightly) towards the bass for me.  I asked PMC about it and they said they would expect this - they 'cross-wire' the Facts for balance when they run single wire, using bass or treble inputs makes a slight emphasis depending on which input you're using. Might be worth a try.

(09-Nov-2015, 09:17)Womaz Wrote: I am also starting to think it is my tinnitus as well .....just googled it and found out it can affect what you hear in music quite a bit.
I am going to try and do more headphone listening later today and see if it is in there too.

Your thoughts on PMC and Devialet are intersting as I never had the brightness with my old MF M6 amp, but then it is not a patch on the 200. Also my eras could have deteriorated too  Big Grin

The tinnitus thing is very interesting.  I have it very slightly this past year - although I never noticed it that much before the Devialet/PMC combo, and a lot of the tinnitus I kind of blame on too much experimenting with the Devialet and speakers.  And like I say I've definitely got a reduction in brightness by taking the PMCs out of the equation.  I'll do some more reading there though.

I think the Devialet has the ability to do incredibly fine detail in the highs.  When I hooked my Teddy Pardo back to compare, there was a much 'thicker' sound to the treble. To be honest, with the PMC's the Teddy sounded more 'right' so perhaps its just closer to the Bryston that they develop the speaker with?

Anyway, I'll spend a week or so with my Neat Motive 1's and see how I feel. I really miss the clarity and depth of the Facts - its a definite downgrade (it should be bearing in mind the costs), but I find their sound  a bit more pleasing at the same time, so at least I know I have a solvable problem in my house!  I'm much like you, my hifi shares my lounge and I've got practically zero options to reposition speakers or listening position, and practically zero options for treatment.  Once you know what you have to work with, the decision gets a bit easier, and if I have to change speaker, then so be it.  I could just go back to my Teddy amp as I still have it, but that defeats the object of having less 'hifi' looking clutter in the lounge...

>>> 1st Place Award: Devialet, last decades most disappointing technology purchase.  <<<

Reply
#24
(09-Nov-2015, 09:42)Hifi_swlon Wrote:
(09-Nov-2015, 09:17)Womaz Wrote: They are bi wire able but my dealer said that it would not make any difference at all to do this , so I took that advice.
I use Tellerium Q black speaker cable which is supposed to be pretty good.

What I meant was not to bi-wire them, but as you have two sets of inputs, wire the speakers only into the bass inputs, rather than into the treble or 'cross-wired'.  This tipped the balance just (slightly) towards the bass for me.  I asked PMC about it and they said they would expect this - they 'cross-wire' the Facts for balance when they run single wire, using bass or treble inputs makes a slight emphasis depending on which input you're using. Might be worth a try.

My apologies but not sure what you mean. Take out the binding post? and wire both speaker cables to the bass only on the speakers?

I will try but would like clarification first before I blow my speakers Big Grin
Devialet 200 -- Roon Nucleus-- Sonus Faber Olympica 2 -- Tellurium Q Black Speaker Cables --
Chord Qutest -- Niimbus US5 Pro Headphone amp —HifiMan HEK, Abyss 1266TC
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Reply
#25
(09-Nov-2015, 10:00)Womaz Wrote: My apologies but not sure what you mean. Take out the binding post? and wire both speaker cables to the bass only on the speakers?

I will try but would like clarification first before I blow my speakers  Big Grin

Perhaps I made it seem more complicated that it is…

Just plug your speaker cable into the LF terminals.  That's it.

I assume the original linking plates go between the LF and HF terminals (unless you've replaced them with your own links?), so that can stay as-is.

It may be you're already doing it that way.

If you remove the linking plates you will definitely get a lot less treble, so wouldn't reccommend you do that ;-)

If in doubt, ignore me and wait for someone else to explain better!

[I just realised you have a 'brightness' thread running, sorry, I guess I should have put this whole lot over there]

>>> 1st Place Award: Devialet, last decades most disappointing technology purchase.  <<<

Reply
#26
I tried this but it made no difference at all to my ears. I am not technical at all, but I didnt think it would as is this not what the binding posts are there for.
Thanks for the input though much appreciated.

Also thread seems to have gone off track a little and I am keen to find out thoughts and opinions on the move from 200 to 400, especially wuth regard to my 23s. Will they do the 400 justice?
Devialet 200 -- Roon Nucleus-- Sonus Faber Olympica 2 -- Tellurium Q Black Speaker Cables --
Chord Qutest -- Niimbus US5 Pro Headphone amp —HifiMan HEK, Abyss 1266TC
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Reply
#27
(09-Nov-2015, 13:31)Womaz Wrote: I tried this but it made no difference at all to my ears. I am not technical at all, but I didnt think it would as is this not what the binding posts are there for.
Thanks for the input though much appreciated.

Also thread seems to have gone off track a little and I am keen to find out thoughts and opinions on the move from 200 to 400, especially wuth regard to my 23s. Will they do the 400 justice?
Hi Womaz,

As with all Hi Fi kit, the only way to find out is to try and home demo the D400. Have you access to a dealer who could loan you a D200 Companion to match with your D200?

All I know is that when I tried the D400 Vs D200, the D400 came out best, hence I went for it, but of course that was in my own home environment, and using my choice of music.

From what I can understand from your earlier Posts, your listening environment is totally different to mine. You have a "minimalist" set up with no carpets, whereas My listening room is fully carpeted, and has fairly large settees and chairs. I have no issues with "brightness" in the way you describe, but there again my music server and speakers are totally different to yours as are, I suspect, my cables.

David
1. NUC6i5SYH running ROON ROCK > ROON/AIR > Ethernet > Devialet 1000pro Core Infinity> Wilson-Benesch ACT Speakers,
or, as alternative, 
2. Wyred4Sound MS-2 Server, Devialet 1000pro Core Infinity, Theta Jade CD Transport, Pure 702ES Tuner, Wilson-Benesch ACT Speakers, misc cables

                                       UK
Reply
#28
(09-Nov-2015, 13:48)brit Wrote:
(09-Nov-2015, 13:31)Womaz Wrote: I tried this but it made no difference at all to my ears. I am not technical at all, but I didnt think it would as is this not what the binding posts are there for.
Thanks for the input though much appreciated.

Also thread seems to have gone off track a little and I am keen to find out thoughts and opinions on the move from 200 to 400, especially wuth regard to my 23s. Will they do the 400 justice?
Hi Womaz,

As with all Hi Fi kit, the only way to find out is to try and home demo the D400. Have you access to a dealer who could loan you a D200 Companion to match with your D200?

All I know is that when I tried the D400 Vs D200, the D400 came out best, hence I went for it, but of course that was in my own home environment, and using my choice of music.

From what I can understand from your earlier Posts, your listening environment is totally different to mine. You have a "minimalist" set up with no carpets, whereas My listening room is fully carpeted, and has fairly large settees and chairs. I have no issues with "brightness" in the way you describe, but there again my music server and speakers are totally different to yours as are, I suspect, my cables.

David

Thanks for the post, there is no way I can demo it, so this would be a blind purchase. I cant go into detail, but the companion will be bought at a large discount to the full price. This is the only reason I am considering it at this stage. I may have considered this way down the line but at this offer it may be too good to refuse. But definitely will be a blind purchase.

I would also hope that it would come out best as its double the price Big Grin

I have posted an update on the brightness I am hearing on the other post.
Devialet 200 -- Roon Nucleus-- Sonus Faber Olympica 2 -- Tellurium Q Black Speaker Cables --
Chord Qutest -- Niimbus US5 Pro Headphone amp —HifiMan HEK, Abyss 1266TC
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Reply
#29
the recommended power input of your speakers is 30 - 150 watts... i dont know if an upgrade of amp is your solution here!
Amp - Devialet 400 Speakers - vivid audio B1 Speaker cable - audioquest oak Power conditioner - furman SPR 16IE Source - audio PC with paul pang audio usb card v3 and paul pang red dual usb cable running through jplay. usb card powered by teddy pardo power supply Source 2 - line in from integra AV receiver (TV)
Reply
#30
Do you mean you think the 400 is too powerful for my 23s? I don't get all the figures stuff and akways took that with a pinch of salt.
It is something I have asked above though
Devialet 200 -- Roon Nucleus-- Sonus Faber Olympica 2 -- Tellurium Q Black Speaker Cables --
Chord Qutest -- Niimbus US5 Pro Headphone amp —HifiMan HEK, Abyss 1266TC
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 2 Guest(s)