(15-Dec-2016, 16:32)MrJellyLord Wrote: I had the chance to compare my own D120 with the new D220Pro in my own home system earlier this week.
I can agree with most of what has been said here; the new 220 obviously has better control in all ranges, plays with greater ease, offers more detail and presents a wider soundstage.
It is a better amp, no doubt.
But is it impressively better than the D120?
Or, to put it differently, did it make me want to spend an extra 3500,- to replace my D120?
The D220pro offers all of the same qualities that convinced me to buy a D120, and adds a tad more of everything, but, after listening to it for a couple of hours, I did not come away feeling like the D120 was a vastly inferior product.
D120 has it own sound which I have come to appreciate more and more every time I hear it.
In the end, it even felt like coming back home again when we switched back to the D120.
All in all, I have decided against upgrading and instead spend the money on my record collection.
Buy high quality s/h isolation feet for Your 120 (Stillpoints Ultra SS) and highest quality power cord You can afford. This will be less then 3500 Euro and You will discover new possibilites of 120.
(31-Dec-2016, 06:49)Damon Wrote: All,
I wanted to follow up my long post (#204) and update my opinion about the Expert Pro sound quality. I should reference many other wise and helpful posts from others, but that would cover several threads and would take me hours to do. Instead, I'll simply say a universal, 'thanks' to posts that followed my upgrade impressions essay.
One aspect of the sound of the Pro that I expressed some concern about was the high end, the treble, and that I felt it might be too .... much, or too metallic? The point of this post is to update that impression. Again, I hope this is useful to others thinking of making the upgrade who might be wondering about the changes the upgrade brings.
About two weeks ago, I rearranged the cables in my system; I created space between the power cords from the speaker cables, and unrolled the loose coils that one speaker cable was in. It is now a long loop under a couch (chesterfield or sofa). I have to say that I was amazed that I was able to hear a difference. The 'glare' or 'metallic' haze that I heard in the top end softened to the extend that I turned the treble up from -2.0 db back to 0 db.
Dr. Tone suggested a change of speaker cables, and I thought his suggestion was steering me in the right direction. Over the christmas holidays I obtained some Analysis Plus Oval 9 speaker cable from the very kind and helpful LeeC, a member of this forum. The AP cable replaced the QED silver 12 that I have been using. The QED is very similar (or probably a bit better) than the Nordost Purple Flare cable in sound quality. I installed the Analysis Plus cable yesterday, and have listened to the system quite carefully for two days. I won't go on about the cables, except to say that the Analysis Plus are much better; the point here is that my concerns or caveat about the high end on the Pro is fully and completely erased.
Correctly separating the power cord and speaker cables made a big difference, I am certain. Curiously, I always felt the left speaker, closest to the amp, was 'sharper' in sound. That was the speaker who's speaker cable was coiled, and which had the amp power cord sitting on top of the speaker cable. So rearranging the cables around that speaker logically made a difference to the sound from that speaker.
Changing from the QED speaker cables, which in retrospect I believe are 'tipped up' in the treble (probably like the lower-end Nordost) in comparison to the Analysis Plus, has refined the sound even further. Others have commented that the Pro sounds more 'analogue' (Confused? Thumb5?) and now I have to agree. The Pro has a wonderful clear, clean, revealing upper end, but it is without harshness. The bass is simply awesome.
In summary, the Pro is more revealing on the treble end of the spectrum, but it is not harsh or sharp. In my case- in my system- the faults I believed I heard were of my own making (sloppy cable arrangement) and in having speaker cables that are very likely not balanced in their presentation.
Cleaning up the cable placement made a noticeable difference in the sound quality. Changing the speaker cables also made a difference. With the Analysis Plus cables the sound is less 'in your face' but it is more midrange forward; the full detail of treble and bass is present but the sharpness that I had commented on earlier is gone.* I've listened in the 'listening chair', as well as while in other rooms, and when sitting directly beside one of the speakers. With cables well-orgainized and more balanced speaker cables installed, the 220 Pro is amazing.
Now listening to Calexico's Hot Rail album and All the Old Showstoppers by the New Pornographers. Loud and totally tubular.... (hybrid of surf slang and tube-audio play on words). What I mean is, it is really, really good. No harshness or sharpness or metallic sheen. It is also correct to note that I think the D220 Pro has softened a bit over 50 or 60 hours of playing, but the cable dressing and cable changing made a notable and important difference in my system; more noticeable than the burn-in effect of the amp.
Verdict on the D200 Pro: Rock, classical, ska, acoustic, jazz, electro-ambient & amateur recordings, this thing sings. This is the amp I always wanted, and now I have it.
(Thanks to Pim, Antoine, boba2013, Wdw, Axel, YabaVR, LeeC, Thumb 5, Confused, Dr. Tone and others. Also to Woodstock; even though he is not a fan of the Pro- I appreciated and respect his opinions about the SQ of the Pro update).
* I know that the AP Oval 9 cables are not filtering out information as I am getting more information and music with the AP cables than I heard before. Source file: 'Down to the River to Pray' from the 'Oh Brother, Where Art Thou?' soundtrack. So many layers of of voices, room acoustics... just wow.
Hi there. Happy New year to all. I have AP Oval 9 somewhere in the closet, should dig them out and give them a listen. A great thing about having a well thought out system is that even changing cables give you different flavours, just like tube rolling. One of my best decisions I've made on this journey and I imagine some of you may shake your head, was to part with my Rogue 150s. I spent more time fretting over tube burn out, that I burned myself out. I've owned Bel Cantos and Chord Amps. in the past but the Devialet by far surpasses them both. What I have noticed thow are Digital Amps are very sensitive to the cable they use so it is good to have a variety on hand to play around with, just like if you were using tubes, except cables don't burn out. Maybe they do but not as quickly.
Gallo Ref. 3.1 with 15 ohm 5 watt resistors across the sub in terminals./Hyperion 968 / Devialet 250 Pro / Marantz SA11 s2 / Nordost Heimdall 2 loudspeaker cable, Heimdall 2 digital cable, Heimdall 2 USB cable, Heimdall 2 interconnect, Power cables are all Heimdall 2 and using Nordost Qx4 in line to the Devialet 250 Pro.
Jrivers for media streaming. Dell 8900 special edition with 250GB SSD, 2TB hard drive with 24GB memory.
Less is more
(18-Dec-2016, 06:35)boba2013 Wrote:
(10-Dec-2016, 06:15)woodstock Wrote:
HI Damon and Woodstock
(10-Dec-2016, 02:25)Damon Wrote: Thanks guys. That was a higher word-count than usual. Just had to get it all out.
I'm amazed that even internet radio is improved.
Pim; you are correct about 'wanting it all' and then reacting to really getting it all. I don't want to embark on a lifetime of gear shopping or swapping, but the source is clearly critical. But we value the ability of the Sonus to get so many streaming services. I like Tidal, and had a subscription, but their catalogue is too limited. We listen to streaming sources most of the time and I sit and do more attentive listening about 10% of the time. Our disc collection is just not very large. So, suggestions welcome!
I will also play with the treble adjustment frequency, and will try AIR again. I haven't used it in over a year, so it will take a bit of re-learning. I haven't fired up the turntable yet, so another project for this weekend.
We have snow here on the coast. Sort of unusual but charming, in a wintery way. A good excuse to stay indoors.
Oh, the pic is of a cat that was on the dock where we tied up last summer when sailing in Croatia. He looks nothing like me.
Hi Damon. West coast? Same here. I'm In Kits If you ever want to connect. As to my new 250 Pro, I'm still undecided. It's a very smooth clean picture but I'm still missing an emotional connection that I had with the older model. It's just a personal preference.
Hmm, seems to be a good representation of Devialet out here on the west coast, (live just west of Cambie on 8th Ave), with experience on the upgrade. I have facilitated back and forth on the upgrade, (D250-->250Pro), for months, and finally decided to go ahead. Having upgraded from D120 to D200 and then to D250, each time has been a very satisfying move so fingers crossed.
When I did the D120-->D200 upgrade, I also upgraded all cables, (speaker and interconnects) to Siltech Anniversary Silver which I thought might push the sound a bit to harsh or tinny side but not at all. The combined upgrade was substantial and then the upgrade to the D250 was simply more in all facets of sound reproduction.
I now have perhaps a month to wait for the Pro250 but it seems by all counts, will be worth it.
On another note, I have been using a Linn Majik DSM with the amp shut down, (just using the streaming portion), which with LINN's Kazoo lets me play Radio Paradise at 320K ACC. Actually sounds right up there with Tidal and other streaming sources. Library is ripped and also plays through the LINN. I hope the promised Streaming card for the Devialet provides the same high quality and reliable streaming and library playback.
Hoping to be able to throw my hat into the ring of satisfied up-graders!!!
Okay, this is a bit early to report but, excited as "all hell"!
Sitting in Ottawa Airport yesterday for flight to T.O. and then to Vancouver, UPS emails me that importation charges, duties and brokerage charges are being covered by Devialet! Unit is out for delivery!
I call my wife once I checked the tracking number and sure enough, would be delivered when I was 30,000 feet above the great lakes! Wife, (good woman she is), promises to be door watching for the carrier!
Sure enough, I land at 10:30PM and call that I am grabbing cab home, again, being the good woman she is, states, your toy has arrived!!
So, upon arriving at home, kissing the wife, petting the dog, pouring a glass of wine, I carry the said delivery to it's home and begin to connect, burn new configuration to match what the D250 previously had and upon double checking everything, (new power cable is sweet)!!, delve into an hour of music testing off the server.
Hotel California off Hell Freezes Over, played Father and Son from Tea and Tillerman which is 192/24, a few cuts from Andre Gagnon’s fabulous piano, Andrea Bocelli’s “La Vie en rose” and Corcovado, Songbird from Eva Cassidy, k.d. lang, Hallelujah,Leonard Cohen, Slow, Moody Blues, “Are you sitting comfortably” which flows into “The Dream” and then flows into “Have You Heard”
Damm, it's 1:30am and I have to be up at 6am.
So, very short test period, damm, I am excited as "all hell" I had missed my D250 and memory is telling me this is really, really good move. I have so much testing, moving speakers, cleaning up cables and so on but man-oh-man, I am 100% happy with the upgrade!
Add my name to the upgrade is damm well worth it list!
Note: What a teaser, after taking out the black amp box from the cardboard shipping container, written in beautiful letters, (250 Pro Master).........hmmm, is a slave in my future??????
Now will need to start on the wife rationalization arguments on why a 250 Pro slave is necessary, not a want but a need!!!
250 Pro Master, Siltech Anniversary Silver Interconnects and Speakers cables, LINN Majik Streamer, Arcam D37 SACD, Mac-mini with Kazoo, JRiver and tested Roon, Speakers, custom build, SEA Exotics, Chord Hugo, HifiMan H1000's. (home is Vancouver, Canada)
I got my updated 120 > 220 pro back yesterday.
I know I should wait to pass judgement until it's played for more than a few hours, but WOW. I kind of feel like I'm too easy to please, but the sound is really vastly improved in every single aspect: detail, imaging, dynamics etc.
I'll write more later but for now I'm totally floored, and I feel the upgrade was worth every penny for me.
Very good to hear that you are totally floored upon first listening. I think that first impressions are just as interesting and valid as 'down the road' impressions. The sound may or may not change, but that simply makes for a good follow up post.
I know that I as well as others were equally impressed by the upgrade, straight out of the box. I agree; vastly improved in every single aspect.
Perhaps the D220 Pro is more demanding, or critical, of setup, as it exposed weakness (or particular characters) in my cabling as well as my own sloppiness in arranging said cables. But I can't say that is a weakness.
In any event, it is good that you are pleased; we're just here to get to the point where we get the sound we want.
Sonos, VPI HW19 mkIII, D220 Pro, Lawrence Audio Violin SE, Analysis Plus Oval 9 speaker cable
i just gave away my d200 for an upgrade. waiting for it now to come back as a 220pro. it's like watching kids grow up...