Poll: Planning to upgrade to Pro?
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Yes, am very likely to upgrade
23.63%
43 23.63%
No, not looking to upgrade
26.37%
48 26.37%
Waiting to get more information about SQ or other benefits
50.00%
91 50.00%
Total 182 vote(s) 100%
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So, who is planning to upgrade to a Pro?
#61
I've been through the process.  I found the decision fairly easy as there are other benefits besides the improved sound quality (which is difficult to quantify without a direct comparison).
The additional inputs (2 Line inputs) and a pre-out for headphones were significant benefits. Perhaps I should have gone for a 200 originally, but this gets me there in 2 installments.
Streaming has always been the weakest part of my system, so possible improved streaming next year is a bonus, though AIR 3.0.1 may fix most issues.
Future firmware updates are likely to focus on the new OS. Lastly there is the new warranty.

As far as I was concerned the 120 was an excellent system, the additional benefits were my incentive to upgrade to a 220Pro, but don't feel you have to. I don't think I would have done it for sound quality alone.
Roon -> AIR -> Ethernet ->  D220-> KEF Reference 3
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#62
(28-Oct-2016, 17:40)Damon Wrote: This week I looked into the upgrade costs more carefully. Having a D120, I understand that I get 'a good deal' in terms of total cash outlay for a D220 Pro; the original cost plus the upgrade is less than the price of a D220 P, which here in Canada is a penny or dollar under $14,000.00.

Paying for the upgrade, done through the Devialet website is 3,450 Euros. It does say it includes all taxes and duties. That will be about $5,200.00 CDN. The dealer price shows a cost close to $6,000.00.

I'm not quibbling with the cost or 'value' of the upgrade, but I wondering why I would make such an investment. By that I mean that I did not buy a D200 18 months ago, so why would I be considering it now? If there was no upgrade path, I certainly would not be considering a new Pro. If there were no new Pro line, I would continue happily with my D120.

I'm certainly interested in the improvements, and I read the posts from others who have the upgrade or who have listened at dealers. I think that I've been caught up in the idea of having the new and current item; an even better version of the amp that I am still crazy about.

I'm not a constant upgrader, and I don't play in the hi-fi hobby by always looking or searching for changes and improvements to my system. If I listened to music and found myself feeling that I wasn't getting what I wanted, then I would go out and snoop around for ways to improve the system. But in truth, I'm very happy with what I have.

I'm really just musing out loud her (in type), and trying to re-balance my own perspective on whether I will do the upgrade. Of course, If I didn't think that others would have some valuable thoughts and comments, I would not write here, so comments are very welcome.

Do any other D120 owners feel themselves in a similar quandary?
I am also not a "hifi junkie". The D120 was part of a new hifi set up after many years of happily listening to my old one.  I am happy with the D120 but have decided to upgrade for three reasons.  Firstly, I suspect I will get some improved sound quality.  The D200 was just outside my budget when I bought my new system - being from the old school - I went for the better quality speakers at the expense of the amp.  Secondly, the D220 will be in line for further technical upgrades.  While I am "old school" I was an early adopter of digital music both as compact discs and now as digital download/streaming.  There could be further improvements to the stability and quality of the whole digital environment.  And thirdly, who can resist a bargain!  It certainly is for the D120 owners. Fortunately, I can now afford this so have signed up for it as soon as the offer became available.

I cannot envisage Devialet keeping this offer open for ever.
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#63
Friends,

Thanks for all the replies. I really do appreciate them. I know that the easy answer would be, 'decide for yourself; your ears, your money'. And that would be valid, certainly.

I have the money, but for me, it is a lot of money; enough that for the cost along I need to be very certain that I will be happier with the new amp than the money. Or else I need to be willing to forgo other purchases in favour of the amp. We do listen to music every day, but rarely do I find the time, or perhaps make the time, to sit and just listen to music. So does that make the serious cash outlay less logical?

I don't know much about the streaming board, but it does come free with the sept - dec upgrade, and that too will add some residual value down the road. And the cost of the upgrade may change in the future, or become unavailable. But that is speculation either way.

One other thought is that if I was looking to spend $5 - 6K on the system, would that be the best way to do so? Oddly, if I was forced to change a component in my system, I'd keep the amp and find new speakers, though I do love the Lawrence Audio speaker. Cables? Power cords?

If the cost were relatively easy to manage, I'd do it for sure. If there was a less expensive upgrade to a D130 Pro, I'd certainly lean that direction. I almost feel like I'm trying to anticipate the potential for regret. Will I regret spending the money or will I regret not having the upgrade?

Anyhow, my thanks again for the excellent comments. I appreciate that you took the time to offer considered, helpful replies to a vague and difficult question.
Damon
Powernode, NAD M32, Cambridge CD transport, Analysis Plus, Nordost, iFi Nova, CSS Criton 1TDX, KEF C62
Vancouver, Canada
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#64
(30-Oct-2016, 18:56)Damon Wrote: Friends,

Thanks for all the replies. I really do appreciate them. I know that the easy answer would be, 'decided for yourself; your ears, your money'. And that would be valid, certainly.

I have the money, but for me, it is a lot of money; enough that for the cost along I need to be very certain that I will be happier with the new amp than the money. Or else I need to be willing to forgo other purchases in favour of the amp. We do listen to music every day, but rarely do I find the time, or perhaps make the time, to sit and just listen to music. So does that make the serious cash outlay less logical?

I don't know much about the streaming board, but it does come free with the sept - dec upgrade, and that too will add some residual value down the road. And the cost of the upgrade may change in the future, or become unavailable. But that is speculation either way.

One other thought is that if I was looking to spend $5 - 6K on the system, would that be the best way to do so? Oddly, if I was forced to change a component in my system, I'd keep the amp and find new speakers, though I do love the Lawrence Audio speaker. Cables? Power cords?

If the cost were relatively easy to manage, I'd do it for sure. If there was a less expensive upgrade to a D130 Pro, I'd certainly lean that direction. I almost feel like I'm trying to anticipate the potential for regret. Will I regret spending the money or will I regret not having the upgrade?

Anyhow, my thanks again for the excellent comments. I appreciate that you took the time to offer considered, helpful replies to a vague and difficult question.

I have to echo Will's comments.    Unless you think you'll be happy with the 120 for many years to come, it would be hard to pass up the 120 to 220 Pro upgrade.... definitely a great deal.   

For me, the improvement from the 200 and the 220 Pro is far more than anything I've ever heard by swapping cables or power cords.   It is significant improvement and clearly sets the stage for the future of the Devialet Expert.  No idea what the new streaming board will bring (or when), but it'll be free now with the upgrade, not likely later. My guess is that if you're on the fence and you can afford it, the only thing you'll regret is not doing it.

Now, the choice is between the upgrade vs buying a significantly better set of speakers (I don't anything about the Lawrence Audio), might be a more challenging choice, but that's apples and oranges and delving there will only make your head hurt.   If it were me and I popped for the speakers instead, I know I'd start wondering how much better they might sound with the 220 Pro.   Just sayin'...  Rolleyes
Devialet 440 Pro (two 220s)- Oracle CD transport - Kuzma Stabi S/Stogi S turntable - Von Schweikert VR-35 speakers - JPS SC3 SCs - PI Audio power conditioning -
Triode Wire Labs ICs and PCs - Roon on NUC 8i7beh running ROCK
Durham, NC USA
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#65
Good thoughts about the long term, both for my use and for future developments. If the 200 >200P was a big jump in SQ, then the 120 > 220P would be equally dramatic at least. The extra physical connections could be a real bonus as well, and add some future-proofing capability.

One thing that has occurred to me is remembering that change from Naim to the D120 made a huge improvement to the sound that came out of my system, and that was consistent using all of the different speakers that I had at the time; ProAc, Neat and GamuT. Changing the speakers never gave me the improvement in clarity, micro-dynamics, and detail that the Devialet gave. Changing speakers did not do what the amp did; the amp was more important. So thinking that way, getting more of the Devialet may be the way to get even more 'goodness' into speakers that I'm totally happy with.

Plus from time to time I find my wife threatening neighbourhood tranquility with John O'callaghan or London Grammar, so the extra power won't go to waste either. Smile
Damon
Powernode, NAD M32, Cambridge CD transport, Analysis Plus, Nordost, iFi Nova, CSS Criton 1TDX, KEF C62
Vancouver, Canada
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#66
(31-Oct-2016, 00:50)Damon Wrote: Changing speakers did not do what the amp did; the amp was more important.

+1 Based on the majority of my past experiences, investing in an amp has almost always yielded better results in the long run.
Kii Three Speakers | JL Audio Fathom Subwoofer  | KEF LS50 Speakers | Samsung 850 Soundbar
Innuos Statement | Trinnov Altitude 32 | PS Audio Stellar S300 Amp | T+A HA 200 Headphone Amplifier | Meze Empyrean Headphones
Sean Jacobs DC-3 Custom Build LPS | Roon Core DIY Server | SOtM sNH-10G Modded Switch | Oppo UDP-205 Blu-Ray/SACD Player
T+A G 2000 R Turntable | DS Audio E1 Optical Stylus | Gordian Lab 12 Power Conditioner | Artesania Audio Rack
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#67
Thanks baconbrain. I tend to agree, thinking back to my experiences over the years. Wonderful speakers can sound completely mediocre with mediocre electronics. It was moving to an old Eico tube receiver from solid state in about 1984 that changed my attitude about hi-fi. Tube amps became a new avenue of pursuit. Eventually I went to Naim boxes, and then of course, to the Devialet. Speakers stayed, but the amps changed.

So, more and better of this amp will put me in good standing for the longer term, as others pointed out. Slowly, cautiously, leaning towards the upgrade....
Damon
Powernode, NAD M32, Cambridge CD transport, Analysis Plus, Nordost, iFi Nova, CSS Criton 1TDX, KEF C62
Vancouver, Canada
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#68
(06-Nov-2016, 21:30)baconbrain Wrote:
(31-Oct-2016, 00:50)Damon Wrote: Changing speakers did not do what the amp did; the amp was more important.

+1 Based on the majority of my past experiences, investing in an amp has almost always yielded better results in the long run.

Unless of course, you were someone like me who moved from a Cambridge Soundworks Ensemble system to a Wilson Audio speaker system, now that was a great leap forward...

   
Roon ROCK on Intel NUC6i5SYH/Ethernet | VPI Avenger | Devialet 440 Pro CI | Vivid Audio Giya G3 | Auralic Aires Mini | Synology 1812+ NAS
SXSW, US
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#69
Probably the improvement 'leap' in these things is somewhat dependent on the specific setup and the weakest part of the system relevant to the rest.

That said I've definitely experienced two sets of speakers becoming significantly better (or at least different) with upgraded amps, and source changes. I know speakers do sound very different to one another, but they can often perform better with better electronics/source attached.

From my perspective I think you're far better off having better electronics and source than speakers. I read this advice elsewhere only after buying quite revealing speakers attached to gear that probably wasn't quite good enough for them. The problem being you 'hear' things yo really don't want to hear - the speakers doing very little to help you out and soften the sound - that's not their job after all. I'm sure it's all very system/preference dependent though.

>>> 1st Place Award: Devialet, last decades most disappointing technology purchase.  <<<

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#70
(07-Nov-2016, 12:14)Hifi_swlon Wrote: Probably the improvement 'leap' in these things is somewhat dependent on the specific setup and the weakest part of the system relevant to the rest.

That said I've definitely experienced two sets of speakers becoming significantly better (or at least different) with upgraded amps, and source changes. I know speakers do sound very different to one another, but they can often perform better with better electronics/source attached.

From my perspective I think you're far better off having better electronics and source than speakers. I read this advice elsewhere only after buying quite revealing speakers attached to gear that probably wasn't quite good enough for them. The problem being you 'hear' things yo really don't want to hear - the speakers doing very little to help you out and soften the sound - that's not their job after all. I'm sure it's all very system/preference dependent though.

The Devialet 200 isn't good enough for the PMC fact 8?! According to Jeff Fritz the 120 is good enough to drive the Magico Q7 mk2, possibly one of the best speakers in the world... 

Guillaume
Industry disclosure: UK distributor for Shunyata Research

220 PRO, totaldac d1 server with additional external power supply, totaldac d1-seven, Echole PSU for Totaldac, Wilson Audio Sasha 2, Shunyata Research cables, Shunyata Hydra Alpha A10 + DPC-6 v3, Various Entreq ground boxes and cables, Entreq Athena level 3 rack, 2 X SOtM sNH-10G with sCLK-EX + 10MHz Master Clock input + sPS-500 PSU, i5 sonicTransporter w/ 1TB SSD

UK
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