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New Pro - SQ for classical music
#21
(07-Nov-2016, 21:28)arcam Wrote: I've received my new Pro and, like most of you, I'm generally over enthusiastic about sound quality...

... except when I am not.

To tell a long story short, SQ is always great for non-classical music, it's great also for recent classical recordings, but it ranges from bad to appauling for less recent classical recordings. At least that's what I have found with my own record collection, bit perfect CD replicas using AIR 3.0, and with Qobuz CD quality (I have yet to try 24-bit recordings).

The older the recording, the more appauling the SQ.
 I am on 10.0.5.

Well...10.0.5 is offering You a digital sound good for a nice demo od new digital recordings. It should impress You.


Nowadays audio gear is mainly produced for short (20-30 min.) listenings. Most people who have money to buy high-end gear doesn't have more time daily for listening. They are making more money;-)

To listen classical music is not a very popular hobby in 2016. And for classical music You need more analogue sound. And only firmware 7.1.3. is offering You a bit of this analogue sound. But Devialet decided to move to another path...so You have new PRO and new firmware 10. They must be right...because most od people are so happy with Their new PRO GEAR...just some old guys remebering old school sounds are not very enthusiastic;-)
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#22
(10-Nov-2016, 09:28)moreno1973 Wrote:
(07-Nov-2016, 21:28)arcam Wrote: I've received my new Pro and, like most of you, I'm generally over enthusiastic about sound quality...

... except when I am not.

To tell a long story short, SQ is always great for non-classical music, it's great also for recent classical recordings, but it ranges from bad to appauling for less recent classical recordings. At least that's what I have found with my own record collection, bit perfect CD replicas using AIR 3.0, and with Qobuz CD quality (I have yet to try 24-bit recordings).

The older the recording, the more appauling the SQ.
 I am on 10.0.5.

Well...10.0.5 is offering You a digital sound good for a nice demo od new digital recordings. It should impress You.


Nowadays audio gear is mainly produced for short (20-30 min.) listenings. Most people who have money to buy high-end gear doesn't have more time daily for listening. They are making more money;-)

To listen classical music is not a very popular hobby in 2016. And for classical music You need more analogue sound. And only firmware 7.1.3. is offering You a bit of this analogue sound. But Devialet decided to move to another path...so You have new PRO and new firmware 10. They must be right...because most od people are so happy with Their new PRO GEAR...just some old guys remebering old school sounds are not very enthusiastic;-)

How delightfully patronising.
UK kit - Technics SP10 - Dynavector DV 507 Mk2 - DH1 cartridge - NUC5i3 - Linux - Roonserver - microRendu  LPS1 PSU - Devialet 1000Pro - Blue Jeans Speaker Cable (1 metre each side) - Magico S5

Spain kit - NUC5i3 - Linux  - Roonserver - microRendu - LPS1 PSU - Devialet D120 - Ergo IX speakers
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#23
(10-Nov-2016, 09:28)moreno1973 Wrote:
(07-Nov-2016, 21:28)arcam Wrote: I've received my new Pro and, like most of you, I'm generally over enthusiastic about sound quality...

... except when I am not.

To tell a long story short, SQ is always great for non-classical music, it's great also for recent classical recordings, but it ranges from bad to appauling for less recent classical recordings. At least that's what I have found with my own record collection, bit perfect CD replicas using AIR 3.0, and with Qobuz CD quality (I have yet to try 24-bit recordings).

The older the recording, the more appauling the SQ.
 I am on 10.0.5.

Well...10.0.5 is offering You a digital sound good for a nice demo od new digital recordings. It should impress You.


Nowadays audio gear is mainly produced for short (20-30 min.) listenings. Most people who have money to buy high-end gear doesn't have more time daily for listening. They are making more money;-)

To listen classical music is not a very popular hobby in 2016. And for classical music You need more analogue sound. And only firmware 7.1.3. is offering You a bit of this analogue sound. But Devialet decided to move to another path...so You have new PRO and new firmware 10. They must be right...because most od people are so happy with Their new PRO GEAR...just some old guys remebering old school sounds are not very enthusiastic;-)

Isn't the hint just in the discription?
As I wrote before in another post the D is just a dump amp. And the DAC does the same thing every time no matter the music genre.

It has to be the recording/file that has the artefacts woven in. If you can proof your copy to be bitperfect (database checked?)...so it is the recording itself. Maybe the (major) label made a new series of copies and they messed up all the new copies (digital distortions because of level)...who knows? Perhaps a trainee at the keyboard?

As for the firmware. I can listen to classical for hours with 10.0.5 on my D200. It's so involving and harmonious. No fatigue...but I have to admit that I tend to fall into sleep when I get too involved...it's like meditation  Blush

gui
- D200 (mod) - ML Motion40 (mod) - Manger P1 (mod) - WS2016/AO 2.20 b5/foobar 1.3.15 - SOX upsampling/jplay 6.2/process lasso server edition (beta)/fidelizer 7.7 Pro/ssd/laptop(mod)/usb-D200 - 
"Oh, you can buy the other. But then it is a cost intensive learning process"
berlin
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#24
(10-Nov-2016, 09:42)NickB Wrote:
(10-Nov-2016, 09:28)moreno1973 Wrote:
(07-Nov-2016, 21:28)arcam Wrote: I've received my new Pro and, like most of you, I'm generally over enthusiastic about sound quality...

... except when I am not.

To tell a long story short, SQ is always great for non-classical music, it's great also for recent classical recordings, but it ranges from bad to appauling for less recent classical recordings. At least that's what I have found with my own record collection, bit perfect CD replicas using AIR 3.0, and with Qobuz CD quality (I have yet to try 24-bit recordings).

The older the recording, the more appauling the SQ.
 I am on 10.0.5.

Well...10.0.5 is offering You a digital sound good for a nice demo od new digital recordings. It should impress You.


Nowadays audio gear is mainly produced for short (20-30 min.) listenings. Most people who have money to buy high-end gear doesn't have more time daily for listening. They are making more money;-)

To listen classical music is not a very popular hobby in 2016. And for classical music You need more analogue sound. And only firmware 7.1.3. is offering You a bit of this analogue sound. But Devialet decided to move to another path...so You have new PRO and new firmware 10. They must be right...because most od people are so happy with Their new PRO GEAR...just some old guys remebering old school sounds are not very enthusiastic;-)

How delightfully patronising.
Lol! Not one to call a spade an earth inverting horticultural implement, are you, Nick?
Project Eperience X Pack with Ortofon Rondo Red MC, Oppo BDP 105D, Sonos Connect, QNAP HS251+ NAS running JRiver, Mutec MC-3+USB, Devialet 440 Pro, Denon AH-D5000, Sennheiser HD600 and HD800 with Cardas cable, Rupert Neve Designs headphone amp., Proac Response D20R, Van Den Hul The First Ultimate interconnects, GSP Audio Spatia speaker cable.
South Coast England
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#25
I think it is fair to say that moreno1973 is a huge fan of firmware 7.1.3, as are many others, this much has been clear for a while. I have to say though that this is going a little off topic. If the answer to any observed sound quality issues is 'use 7.1.3' then we are not going to get anywhere in the 'Pro' era. I have to say though that based on my relatively short time with a Pro, the difference between an 'Expert' amp and the new 'Pro' is an absolute order of magnitude larger than the sound quality differences between firmware versions. (plus I suspect moreno1973 may not have had the pleasure of listening to a Pro yet, but I might be wrong) Although I have to say that I do not understand how anyone could design an amp to sound good 'mainly produced for short (20-30 min.) listenings.' I recall the upset from some when it was reported that Devialet develop their amps based on measurements from lab equipment, that is chasing measured performance rather than 'tuning by ear'. Can lab equipment tell you that something will sound good for half an hour then get fatiguing? My thoughts is that lab equipment would be better served in developing towards theoretical perfection.

As for the Pro 'sound', if we take 'analogue' to mean sounding real, the Pro is the most 'analogue', real and detailed thing I have ever listened to at any price. This is why I would like to keep this thread on topic. As an example, I was listening to some classical music last night. I deliberately chose something that I knew was ripped from quite an old CD. It sounded fine, but there was maybe something in the sound that was less than perfect, a kind of digital edge. (although nothing I would describe as 'digital artifacts'). In casual listening it sounded perfect, but listen hard, and yes, maybe there is something. This got me wondering if what I was hearing was in fact resulting from the quality of the original analogue to digital conversion used in creating the digital master. (The CD was early 90's I think) I find this interesting, this is why I'd love to try some of the exact recordings motioned by the OP.
1000 Pro - KEF Blade - microRendu - Mutec MC3+USB - Pro-Ject Signature 12
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#26
(10-Nov-2016, 11:32)Confused Wrote: As for the Pro 'sound', if we take 'analogue' to mean sounding real, the Pro is the most 'analogue', real and detailed thing I have ever listened to at any price.  

What about playing a record of some decent classical music on the 1000 PRO? Would that sound more "analogue" than a CD rip?

Guillaume
Industry disclosure: UK distributor for Shunyata Research

O d'A no.63, Absolare Integrated Signature, totaldac d1 server with additional external power supply, totaldac d1-six, Wilson Audio Sasha 2, Transparent Ref XL digital cables, Transparent XL Gen 5 speaker cables, Ansuz Diamond Darkz, Shunyata mains cable prototypes, Shunyata Denali D6000/S, Shunyata Venom RCA, Audioquest Diamond Ethernet, Various Entreq ground boxes and cables, AQVOX Audiophile High-End Network Switch, sonicTransporter w/ 1TB SSD & MCRU LPS
UK
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#27
(10-Nov-2016, 12:01)GuillaumeB Wrote:
(10-Nov-2016, 11:32)Confused Wrote: As for the Pro 'sound', if we take 'analogue' to mean sounding real, the Pro is the most 'analogue', real and detailed thing I have ever listened to at any price.  

What about playing a record of some decent classical music on the 1000 PRO? Would that sound more "analogue" than a CD rip?

Guillaume
I've only got 'round to playing one side of one record so far, since I've had the Pro.  To be honest, I dived into a 12" record box and just picked out the first thing that came to hand as something to try to make sure I'd wired up the TT correctly and to check config setting were OK.  This was a Gary Numan album, I don't think that counts as decent classical? Confused   It's early days though......
1000 Pro - KEF Blade - microRendu - Mutec MC3+USB - Pro-Ject Signature 12
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#28
(10-Nov-2016, 11:32)Confused Wrote: I recall the upset from some....

I reacted to this, yes. I do not in any way oppose use of measurements when developing audio equipment. Quite the opposite.
My reaction to Mr Pernod's explanation was that it seemed they do very little or no listening when working with designs. Listening should support measurements. Measurements alone can take an audio design in the wrong direction. Only listening can reveal this and work as correction, but of course a design like ADH must measure well!
*
Netgear Ultra 2+ NAS:: Roon Core on Debian Linux::Intel NUC::Audiolense 5.0 filters::microRendu::LPS-1::Mutec MC-3+USB::250 Pro::Monitor Audio MA201 (thoroughly rebuilt, now with a SAM profile)



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#29
Just as an add on to my earth turning remarks earlier. I have introduced a couple of mates to Devialet, one was a Naim user the other was a serial valve user. Both are absolutely amazed at the more musical claen and uncluttered presentation of the Devialet 120's they have since bought. The valve amp user (a PP 300 B amp) for those interested was amazed by the ability of the D120 to show him the capabilities of his system/speakers which he had never known before. He phoned me up about 3 weeks ago to say that he had listened to his system for 8 hours solid and loved every second.
Both are using Ver 10.05 software and both listen to lots of classical music, the ex Naim user listens almost exclusively to classical in fact.

One has now ordered his update from 120 to a 220 Pro.
UK kit - Technics SP10 - Dynavector DV 507 Mk2 - DH1 cartridge - NUC5i3 - Linux - Roonserver - microRendu  LPS1 PSU - Devialet 1000Pro - Blue Jeans Speaker Cable (1 metre each side) - Magico S5

Spain kit - NUC5i3 - Linux  - Roonserver - microRendu - LPS1 PSU - Devialet D120 - Ergo IX speakers
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#30
Tongue 
(10-Nov-2016, 11:32)Confused Wrote:  (plus I suspect moreno1973 may not have had the pleasure of listening to a Pro yet, but I might be wrong) 

You are wrong:-)

I heard 440. Just digital sound full of details. But no great musicality (musicality IMO means natural sound of acoustic instruments). And its price  £11,980.00   

THIS IS MADNESS, NO... THIS IS DEVIALET Wink

Do You want great natural sounding amp for good price? Compare 220 with firmware 10.0.5 with this:

http://www.accuphase.com/model/e-370.html
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