A Confused streaming system - Mutec / SOtM Ultra

[Confused]

@Confused
You must have boundless energy and patience.  I don’t think I could cope with that many changes.
Fascinating reading even if I have no intention of ever trying any of the items in question.
I have plenty to keep me busy refining FIR filters for my Phantoms.

Anyhoo, to my question and please forgive me if I have missed the answer to this in earlier posts.
I believe you prefer the Devialet aes input and use the Mutec to convert usb to aes?
Now that you have all of this wonderful new kit, should you also revisit the Devialet usb input, especially with the txusbultra which appears to be the star performer.

Boundless energy and patience?  I have to say that by early afternoon on Sunday I was sick to death of A/B testing. On Saturday I was quite enjoying it, but eventually you hit a limit and it is not possible to concentrate on the differences anymore, everything starts to sound the same and you can start to focus only on the negatives.  It's an important point I think, because reading back through what I have written, in some areas it is a little negative towards the SOtM kit.  So as another update, I can advise that on Sunday afternoon I had given up on the experimentation and was just playing whatever music I fancied.  This offered a few unexpected 'wow' moments.  A case of hidden layers in the music being revealed, not so much detail, but texture.  I am not sure if the old and overused 'it was like lifting a veil' metaphor works here, this was more like putting your hand behind the veil and having a poke around.

In other words, with the SOtM kit is sounding pretty impressive now.

As for trying the SOtM bundle via USB, no I have not tried this, although it is something that I want to try.  I have read about a case of someone who was running a very similar set up to myself, including the Mutec REF10, although in his case the MC3+USB was feeding a Chord Dave.  He tried running the SOtM kit via USB, and found this provided a superior result.  I suspect that with the Devialet, that the MC3+USB feeding via AES/EBU will be best, but I am open minded to the possibility that with the CI equipped Pro maybe USB could come out on top.  So this is well worth a try I think.  In fact, it is now second on my list of things to try.  First on my list of things to try is the SOtM modified switch that I have yet to put into my system, so this needs to be tried before the USB vs AES/EBU comparison.

At the moment I am keen to try the switch, but a big part of me want to pause all the upgrading and testing stuff.  Sometimes you need to just enjoy the system, play what you want to listen to and forget the technical stuff.  This is when you really learn how good the recent upgrades or whatever are performing, when you are not thinking about them.

[petrik]

As for trying the SOtM bundle via USB, no I have not tried this, although it is something that I want to try.  I have read about a case of someone who was running a very similar set up to myself, including the Mutec REF10, although in his case the MC3+USB was feeding a Chord Dave.  He tried running the SOtM kit via USB, and found this provided a superior result.  I suspect that with the Devialet, that the MC3+USB feeding via AES/EBU will be best, but I am open minded to the possibility that with the CI equipped Pro maybe USB could come out on top.  So this is well worth a try I think.  In fact, it is now second on my list of things to try.  First on my list of things to try is the SOtM modified switch that I have yet to put into my system, so this needs to be tried before the USB vs AES/EBU comparison.

This will be really interesting comparison. Please note that you might experience some issues with the USB-input when using SOtM. You probably should wait for a next Devialet FW before trying this.
https://devialetchat.com/showthread.php?tid=4997

[alandbush]

Sometimes you need to just enjoy the system, play what you want to listen to and forget the technical stuff.  This is when you really learn how good the recent upgrades or whatever are performing, when you are not thinking about them.

I cannot agree more, especially after a recent update went from Wow! to What happened? after I tinkered again. Eventually backing out the tinker restored the former Wow.
Sometimes you have to ‘live’ with a change long enough to recognise the effects, bad or good, that a subsequent change makes.
Give yourself some breathing space and enjoy what you have for now.

[yabaVR]

...

At the moment I am keen to try the switch, but a big part of me want to pause all the upgrading and testing stuff.  Sometimes you need to just enjoy the system, play what you want to listen to and forget the technical stuff.  This is when you really learn how good the recent upgrades or whatever are performing, when you are not thinking about them.

Hey Confused,
that's absolutely right. Give the new system time to burn in and give it some long time listening sessions. Then after a few days switch back to your old system or another combination and you will rapidly know which system gives the most.

Of what I'm reading of the SOtM stuff it gives more resolution/tranparency/better timing to a system. Resolution/transparency always comes with the predisposition of being a 'magnet'  for noise and 'digital artefacts'...e.g. a (or multiple) SMPS (phone/tablet/lamp/any device) plugged in elsewhere in your listening room may have had no big impact on the sound before (you couldn't recognize) but is now giving you this 'digital touch' that adds on to the 'not burned in' texture in the sound of the new system.

High resoluting systems get very fragile to the point that even a grounding cable connected from a TT to the Devialet can act as an 'antenna' for noise. Try disconnecting (and pull the plug) every other device from your Devialet and listen again. The improvement might surprise you. I don't want to get you paranoid just want to make you sensitve of effects you wouldn't think of that have an impact on the sound.
It's difficult to explain but I made the experience many times that SMPS regardless of their positioning in the room have a profound negative influence on the sound. Try it with the SMPS that came with your mobile...listen.

gui

p.s. If it'd withstand we have to give this a new test name     PAM-Test - Paranoid Audiophile Madness (based on the SAM-test)

edit: ...oh, when everything has calmed down try the SAM-Test again with the new system. I can think of getting even better and more differentiated results out of the SAM-Test this time

[Confused]

Another weekend of A/B testing for me, but not for my recently acquired SOtM modified switch. In fact, I decided on Saturday that I had had enough of A/B testing for a while, and just wanted to enjoy some music. Although the switch was tempting me, so I decided to install the thing, if only to commence getting some hours on it. The idea being that when I do A/B test the switch, at least 'burn in' is eliminated as a potential factor. And a very enjoyable Saturday of listening it was too, the system was sounding splendid, but there was still this niggle about the microRendu maybe being slightly smoother in the higher frequencies. Next week will mark one month from the date I received the SOtM 'bundle'. This is significant because I have the option to return within one month, by next weekend it is time out. For this reason, I decided that I should try another direct comparison of the SOtM bundle versus the microRendu, as things have worked out, I'm glad I did.

So on Sunday morning I pulled the SOtM kit out of the rack in a way that would make cable swapping quick and easy. I was also in a much better frame of mind than I was last week when I tried this comparison, on that occasion I was quite simply trying to cram too much into one day, today I was relaxed and far more focused on the task. Furthermore, I now had a better idea as to what exactly was niggling me about the SOtM kit, there were some very specific parts of some recordings that were troubling me. So to the listening, this time I was taking notes, and if I noticed something that was not quite right, I was making a note, marking the time, going back, rechecking, you get the idea. I could write for hours about some of the observations, but I do not have time so I will go to the key issue. What I have found is that the SOtM kit is better than the microRendu, and it is better in every aspect right the way through the frequency range with much better dynamics on top. OK, this will probably not win the shock revelation of the week prize. The interesting thing though is that there appears to be a difference in the treble balance between the microRendu and the SOtM kit, with the SOtM kit being the brighter of the two. As a double check on this point, I ripped a CD of a couple of the tracks I was using in the comparison and played them through the Mutec MC3+USB / REF10 combo direct from my Blu-Ray player. This was worthwhile doing because in terms of this treble balance issue, this indicated that it was the microRendu that is a little dull, rather than the SOtM kit being too bright, a similar check using Devialet's AIR streaming direct yielded a similar result. OK, here I am lucky to have a Devialet amp that has good old-fashioned tone controls. Subjectively, I was finding that turning the treble up maybe +2 or +3 dB on the Devialet brought the microRendu on a par with the SOtM in terms of treble balance, or you could go -2dB down to take the SOtM to microRendu levels. With this established, I revisited some of the sections of music that were troubling me with the SOtM kit, the result being that these sections became even more troubling via the microRendu. It would appear that I was simply picking up on characteristics inherent with the recording themselves, with the microRendu, these are masked to a degree, with the SOtM, they are not. Take the same section of music with the slightly niggling section, treble down -3dB on the Devialet, the aspect that was niggling me is no longer apparent enough to bother me. To take a specific example, the sound of a snare might sound a touch distorted, with the SOtM you can clearly hear a touch distorted snare, with the microRendu, more distorted, less snare, take the treble down 3dB, you can still hear it, but it ceases to become a niggle. With this understood, and indeed a way to equalise the issue, things fell into place and I could start to concentrate on other aspects of the presentation without being niggled by one thing, and yes, the SOtM kit can pull out some real magic in terms of textured bass, atmosphere, realism and all the rest of it.

This leads me to an open question, I am sure we can all agree that both the microRendu and SOtM kit are capable of receiving an Ethernet input and creating a 'bit perfect' USB stream from this. No bit are being lost or changed, this would surely result in pops, clicks and similar. So, both devices are feeding the same bits to the MC3+USB. How then is it possible for one device to sound like the treble is turned down 3dB? I could speculate on answers to this, but it would just be speculation. Can anyone offer a decent explanation of this? I am thinking noise, but how does 'noise' in the system specifically blunt treble? Curious, but I would appreciate any better explanations of this. This point was touched upon in the thread between myself, thumb5 and ogs last week, but now I am as clear as I subjectively can be that there is a clear difference in the treble between the mR and other sources, it is far to apparent to be imagined.

While I am at it, a note to @yabaVR, if I count SMPS's on the ground floor of my house I get 14 in my main living room, plus another 4 in the kitchen. Pretty horrific! So maybe a A/B check before and after a SMPS purge might be interesting when I get the time. Unfortunately, I cannot purge all of them, one is running my PC, another the router that feeds my streaming system, one powers the SOtM kit. OK, those could be replaced with LPSU's, but then there are another two inside of the Devialet's themselves, not much I can do about that. But the one connected to the radio in the kitchen, the phone chargers, the TV, TV digital box and so on, could all be powered down for a check. Might be interesting.

As one last point, with the one month sale or return date approaching fast, the SOtM bundle is staying in my rack!

[Dan]

Not suggesting you go on forever comparing but I wonder what your thoughts would be if you were comparing the UltraRendu? (assuming you are using your original mRendu). I have gone down the slope of the SOtM trio myself and do like it better then my original mRendu (with no updates). I find myself wondering, though, what the UltraRendu - mutec - (with ref 10) to Devialet 1000 would be like??? Maybe even add the SOtM UltraUSB???

Where to stop is the question, I guess......

[yabaVR]

@Confused
You don't have to purge every bit of SMPS that you have. Just pull one or two and listen again to a song you know well. Do this while A/B testing. Or even better do this at that moment you hear something disturbing in the sound and making a note. Keep your pencil at hand because you might have to add a note that the sound is no longer disturbing when the SMPS are pulled.
If you once heard the effect of SMPS on audio sound you will hear every single one you pull. But for now pull as much as it's comfortable for you to have a very clear effect.

gui

[Excommunication]

There are so many things at play; Hans Beekhuyzen came to the conclusion to add a Pink Faun Lan Isolator in the mix reduced the siblance with a guessed 90%.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPWS3Lk6y1g&t=395s

[Pim]

There are so many things at play; Hans Beekhuyzen came to the conclusion to add a Pink Faun Lan Isolator in the mix reduced the siblance with a guessed 90%.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPWS3Lk6y1g&t=395s

I just watched it. A bit hard to understand what his final thoughts were on the Audioquest USB  / Ethernet cables compared to the Pink Faun Lan Isolator but if I understood right, the PFLI had the largest impact of the three. That's impressive.

[Confused]

Not suggesting you go on forever comparing but I wonder what your thoughts would be if you were comparing the UltraRendu? (assuming you are using your original mRendu). I have gone down the slope of the SOtM trio myself and do like it better then my original mRendu (with no updates). I find myself wondering, though, what the UltraRendu - mutec - (with ref 10) to Devialet 1000 would be like??? Maybe even add the SOtM UltraUSB???

Where to stop is the question, I guess......

I'd love to try the ultraRendu!  The ultraRendu was my original plan A, I wanted something better than the mR, but I did have some reservations about the current SOtM kit, so my plan was to run the ultraRendu, and then see what SOtM may bring out in the future.  Obviously this plan changed! 

If someone out there wants to lend me one I would love to try it!  (and maybe the Antipodes Edge as well, plus a few other things)

Meanwhile, I am happy with what I have and I am looking forward to more time enjoying listening to the system, rather than playing with the system.

In fact, I think these network 'end point streamers' have to be the fastest developing part of the audio market at the moment.  So my best plan is to enjoy what I have and see what Sonore & co come out with next, I am sure this market will have many interesting new products emerging over the next year or two.