Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Music resolution graphical representation from Pono!
#1
Hello buddies

I came across this graphical representation of how Pono perceives and try to promote their view of different resolutions available

[Image: e6fe7b6c47a840e01b4c9cd2602597d6.jpg]

What do you think? Do you agree? Or would you describe/represent it differently?
Aurender X100L / Transrotor Crescendo TT / Denon DCD1520 / Macbook Pro >> D400 >> Martin Logan Montis
amabrok's system - Latest update (May 2015, Page 11, Post #109)

Dubai, UAE
Reply
#2
So this is Neil's way of telling us he's going to sell 20.000.000 albums that sound like you're 200ft deep in water... someone needs to teach him about advertising....

This is what DR Aix had to say about it. The picture didn't copy but it's where it says 'underwater_pono_gfx'

An Open Letter to Neil Young

Dr. AIX

Neil,

You may not remember me, but we've met and chatted briefly years ago at a post house in Northern California while working on a DVD project. Larry Johnson and I were very good friends and he was kind enough to involve my company (AIX Media Group) with the DVD production of "Rust Never Sleeps" [I'm very proud of the Gold DVD that hangs on the studio wall] and an early Bonnaroo DVD. Larry made me a hero when he got my daughter backstage passes to one of the bridge concerts...she was very impressed with the show and with me. I was deeply saddened by his passing.

I've known audio engineer Elliot Mazer for years and became friends with John Hamm during the first half of 2013.

And I'm a fan. I've seen you live (including in April in Hollywood), purchased your music on vinyl LP, cassettes, CDs, and even Blu-ray. I've followed your pursuit of better sound. I was impressed and supportive when you spoke out loudly against the problems with the compact disc format. Your continuing battle against heavily compressed MP3s and calls to get back to the "soul" or music struck a resonant chord with me. I was a believer.

I've been involved with high-resolution or high-definition audio since the very beginning as an engineer, producer, and the owner of a small audiophile record label. My company authored and released the very first DVD-Video titles released in the US back in March of 1997. When the DVD-Audio format emerged in 2000, I acquired the tools and went to work learning how to produce and release ultimate fidelity consumer discs...we made the first DVD-Audio disc, too. I've stayed current with the march of technology by moving to Blu-ray (we released the first Blu-ray 3D music disc...back in 2013) and launching the world's first high-resolution digital music download site (only newly recorded high-res productions are available on the site) in 2007.

AIX Records has produced and released almost 100 high-resolution albums. The biggest names on the label are Willie Nelson, Rita Coolidge, Paul Williams, John McEuen, Jennifer Warnes, and John Gorka...not current hit makers but really talented musicians that can sing and play music that touches the heart. And we do it all in high-resolution...both audio and video!

I was thrilled when John Hamm, your former Pono CEO and a true music lover and engineer, sat entranced when I played him some of my favorite HD-Audio tracks in our demo room at AXPONA last April. He insisted on taking a couple of disc back and promised to play them for you. I don't know if he did or not but I'm sure you would find them among the best recordings you've ever heard. The folks at the high-end magazines, many Pono supporters and AIX customers rave about the sound of our productions...very open, clear, dynamic, and warm. If you're interested, I can certainly hook you up with some files or a disc.

I'm a member of the audio board at the CEA, on the high-resolution working group of the AES, and a long-standing member of The Recording Academy. In fact, I will be on a panel of "Music Creators" at the International 2015 CES High-Resolution Audio Marketplace immediately prior to your session in the same ballroom. AIX Records/iTrax will have a small 10 x 10 booth with a small playback system, some amazing headphones, and demos of our tracks. I know you'll be swamped but I would love to get a moment of your time while you there.

I'm writing today about Pono and PonoMusic. I've followed your efforts to push high-resolution audio since prior to the amazing Kickstarter campaign back in April. I saw you David Letterman with the early prototype, listened to your presentations/interviews at SXSW and All Things Digital. I've read the pieces on Computer Audiophile and your own site. I was an enthusiastic supporter. For the first time a major music industry icon was saying the things that I've been saying...except when you speak, people listen. My ten-year effort has made a small dent in the traditional music business façade; your Pono effort has split it wide open. Kudos.

But I write this letter because I'm concerned that the message about "rediscovering the soul of music", master quality transfers, high-resolution music and "hearing things as the artist intended" have been pushed to the back burner in favor of business opportunism and "high-res" download market share. Why did you previously rage against the fidelity of compact discs and then embrace CD rips for over 99% of the available music at PonoMusic? If the fidelity of CDs was unacceptable in the past and equivalent to being "underwater" (see your graphic below), how can you now accept CDs as acceptable?

underwater_pono_gfx

Figure 1 - A graphic provided by Pono showing the relative qualities of audio formats. [Click to enlarge]

I know they are the "best available" masters right now and that you've promised to "upgrade" Pono supporters when real high-resolution versions become available. But in reality, the vast majority of albums on the site will never be remastered and made available on PonoMusic in high-resolution. John Hamm told the assembled group and me at AXPONA last April, "that PONO would not be in the business of remastering". I realize he's no longer the CEO, but has that position changed?

I have long advocated (I write a daily article about high-resolution audio read by many thousands of readers) that the entire production chain from microphone to speaker be documented in terms of equipment, recording format, mixing gear, mastering information, conversion etc. And I want this "metadata" or the "provenance" of each recording to be included with the files provided by the likes of HDTracks and PonoMusic. I know it's very hard to acquire that information and that the labels are committed to doing better as more masters get transferred. But consumers interested in high-resolution audio want to know that their dollars are being spent on music that will sound better than previous versions now. Today, many are disappointed in the catalog of so-called "high-resolution" music downloads.

My goal is to fully inform music lovers to the realities of formats, specifications, fidelity, production paths, source audio quality vs. deliver containers, and try to build on honesty and excitement. I believe this is the only path forward.

From my vantage point, this isn't happening at the labels, download sites, organizations, and at Pono. I'm hoping that being "righteous" includes being open and honest about the decisions that you and your company are making. There is an emerging market for better sound...but launching a very high quality player and then pushing rips of CDs through it isn't "getting the soul the music". I hope you agree and get back to the original message before it's too late.

I would welcome the opportunity to discuss high-resolution audio with you and/or your representatives.

Respectfully yours,

Mark Waldrep
                                                    Lifetime Roon, Mac mini, int. SSD, ext. HDD, tv as monitor, key board and track pad on bean bag as remote,Devialet 200, Od'A #097, Blue jeans speaker cable,                                     
                                                                                                                                                                            Dynaudio C1 MkII.
                                                                                                                                                                              Jim Smith's GBS.
                                                                                                                                                                        Northern NSW Australia.
Reply
#3
(03-Jan-2015, 11:14)Pim van Vliet Wrote: So this is Neil's way of telling us he's going to sell 20.000.000 albums that sound like you're 200ft deep in water... someone needs to teach him about advertising....

I did not follow all the buzz on the Pono thing! but which resolution do they claim they will offer? because when i saw this graphical representation i thought they will offer at least 24/192 (of course not judging here the source from which they will offer the 24/192), is that right?
Aurender X100L / Transrotor Crescendo TT / Denon DCD1520 / Macbook Pro >> D400 >> Martin Logan Montis
amabrok's system - Latest update (May 2015, Page 11, Post #109)

Dubai, UAE
Reply
#4
(03-Jan-2015, 11:39)amabrok Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 11:14)Pim van Vliet Wrote: So this is Neil's way of telling us he's going to sell 20.000.000 albums that sound like you're 200ft deep in water... someone needs to teach him about advertising....

I did not follow all the buzz on the Pono thing! but which resolution do they claim they will offer? because when i saw this graphical representation i thought they will offer at least 24/192 (of course not judging here the source from which they will offer the 24/192), is that right?

The've gone into bed with a company who has 20 million cd rips in their library. They say their aim is to replace any low res stuff for higher resolution releases when they become available. But you can only get a higher resolution recording if it's already been recorded in high res. So a 'brand new 24/192 version' of an old recording will still have the same SQ of the original.

As far as I'm concerned Pono is a good sounding player (reviewed here http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2014/1...the-money/)
and the Pono site sells the same stuff you can get at any cd store. ( the stuff they claim sounds like you're 200ft under water)Tongue
                                                    Lifetime Roon, Mac mini, int. SSD, ext. HDD, tv as monitor, key board and track pad on bean bag as remote,Devialet 200, Od'A #097, Blue jeans speaker cable,                                     
                                                                                                                                                                            Dynaudio C1 MkII.
                                                                                                                                                                              Jim Smith's GBS.
                                                                                                                                                                        Northern NSW Australia.
Reply
#5
(03-Jan-2015, 15:01)Pim van Vliet Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 11:39)amabrok Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 11:14)Pim van Vliet Wrote: So this is Neil's way of telling us he's going to sell 20.000.000 albums that sound like you're 200ft deep in water... someone needs to teach him about advertising....

I did not follow all the buzz on the Pono thing! but which resolution do they claim they will offer? because when i saw this graphical representation i thought they will offer at least 24/192 (of course not judging here the source from which they will offer the 24/192), is that right?

The've gone into bed with a company who has 20 million cd rips in their library. They say their aim is to replace any low res stuff for higher resolution releases when they become available. But you can only get a higher resolution recording if it's already been recorded in high res. So a 'brand new 24/192 version' of an old recording will still have the same SQ of the original.

As far as I'm concerned Pono is a good sounding player (reviewed here http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2014/1...the-money/)
and the Pono site sells the same stuff you can get at any cd store. ( the stuff they claim sounds like you're 200ft under water)Tongue

Then they are indeed foolish or know nothing about Marketing: Smile


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Aurender X100L / Transrotor Crescendo TT / Denon DCD1520 / Macbook Pro >> D400 >> Martin Logan Montis
amabrok's system - Latest update (May 2015, Page 11, Post #109)

Dubai, UAE
Reply
#6
(03-Jan-2015, 15:24)amabrok Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 15:01)Pim van Vliet Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 11:39)amabrok Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 11:14)Pim van Vliet Wrote: So this is Neil's way of telling us he's going to sell 20.000.000 albums that sound like you're 200ft deep in water... someone needs to teach him about advertising....

I did not follow all the buzz on the Pono thing! but which resolution do they claim they will offer? because when i saw this graphical representation i thought they will offer at least 24/192 (of course not judging here the source from which they will offer the 24/192), is that right?

The've gone into bed with a company who has 20 million cd rips in their library. They say their aim is to replace any low res stuff for higher resolution releases when they become available. But you can only get a higher resolution recording if it's already been recorded in high res. So a 'brand new 24/192 version' of an old recording will still have the same SQ of the original.

As far as I'm concerned Pono is a good sounding player (reviewed here http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2014/1...the-money/)
and the Pono site sells the same stuff you can get at any cd store. ( the stuff they claim sounds like you're 200ft under water)Tongue

Then they are indeed foolish or know nothing about Marketing: Smile


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They are not marketing to those in the know but rather those who believe MP3 is as good as it gets. They only need to tell just enough truth to reel you in.

They were at Dreamforce this year and let me tell you they are marketing effectively and doing well right now.

I am not a supporter but I have heard a preproduction unit and it is the real deal for portability within reason.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Digital: ROON on Synology & SONOS Connect
Analog: Marantz TT-15s1 - ClearAudio Virtuoso MM Wood

Main: Devialet D250 - KEF LS50
Reply
#7
(04-Jan-2015, 07:52)adhesiv Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 15:24)amabrok Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 15:01)Pim van Vliet Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 11:39)amabrok Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 11:14)Pim van Vliet Wrote: So this is Neil's way of telling us he's going to sell 20.000.000 albums that sound like you're 200ft deep in water... someone needs to teach him about advertising....

I did not follow all the buzz on the Pono thing! but which resolution do they claim they will offer? because when i saw this graphical representation i thought they will offer at least 24/192 (of course not judging here the source from which they will offer the 24/192), is that right?

The've gone into bed with a company who has 20 million cd rips in their library. They say their aim is to replace any low res stuff for higher resolution releases when they become available. But you can only get a higher resolution recording if it's already been recorded in high res. So a 'brand new 24/192 version' of an old recording will still have the same SQ of the original.

As far as I'm concerned Pono is a good sounding player (reviewed here http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2014/1...the-money/)
and the Pono site sells the same stuff you can get at any cd store. ( the stuff they claim sounds like you're 200ft under water)Tongue

Then they are indeed foolish or know nothing about Marketing: Smile


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They are not marketing to those in the know but rather those who believe MP3 is as good as it gets. They only need to tell just enough truth to reel you in.

They were at Dreamforce this year and let me tell you they are marketing effectively and doing well right now.

I am not a supporter but I have heard a preproduction unit and it is the real deal for portability within reason.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So how do think their player compare to Astell&Kern for example?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Aurender X100L / Transrotor Crescendo TT / Denon DCD1520 / Macbook Pro >> D400 >> Martin Logan Montis
amabrok's system - Latest update (May 2015, Page 11, Post #109)

Dubai, UAE
Reply
#8
(04-Jan-2015, 08:04)amabrok Wrote:
(04-Jan-2015, 07:52)adhesiv Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 15:24)amabrok Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 15:01)Pim van Vliet Wrote:
(03-Jan-2015, 11:39)amabrok Wrote: I did not follow all the buzz on the Pono thing! but which resolution do they claim they will offer? because when i saw this graphical representation i thought they will offer at least 24/192 (of course not judging here the source from which they will offer the 24/192), is that right?

The've gone into bed with a company who has 20 million cd rips in their library. They say their aim is to replace any low res stuff for higher resolution releases when they become available. But you can only get a higher resolution recording if it's already been recorded in high res. So a 'brand new 24/192 version' of an old recording will still have the same SQ of the original.

As far as I'm concerned Pono is a good sounding player (reviewed here http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2014/1...the-money/)
and the Pono site sells the same stuff you can get at any cd store. ( the stuff they claim sounds like you're 200ft under water)Tongue

Then they are indeed foolish or know nothing about Marketing: Smile


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They are not marketing to those in the know but rather those who believe MP3 is as good as it gets. They only need to tell just enough truth to reel you in.

They were at Dreamforce this year and let me tell you they are marketing effectively and doing well right now.

I am not a supporter but I have heard a preproduction unit and it is the real deal for portability within reason.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So how do think their player compare to Astell&Kern for example?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

According to John Darko not bad at all. Given the price it's definitely a winner but don't confuse the player with the downloads they sell.
                                                    Lifetime Roon, Mac mini, int. SSD, ext. HDD, tv as monitor, key board and track pad on bean bag as remote,Devialet 200, Od'A #097, Blue jeans speaker cable,                                     
                                                                                                                                                                            Dynaudio C1 MkII.
                                                                                                                                                                              Jim Smith's GBS.
                                                                                                                                                                        Northern NSW Australia.
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)