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Martin Logan Summit X
#21
So... I have read the various posts about the difference between the D200 and D250 cases and the heat issue. That was a concern for me at first. But, I am not getting much heat from my system. It gets mildly warm at worst, but not good ole' Class A amp hot.

FYI. I recently had the benefit of a one (1) hour sitdowm with two (2) Devialet reps here at my dealer's store. Great guys. Very knowledgable as one might imagine. I asked about the issue. They said that the difference between the D200 and D250 is one extra 50 watt D amp module in the 250, plus the different case design to provide some extra cooling.

They told me to go with the D400 versus D250, so that I why I am where I am.




(15-Jan-2015, 00:09)Confused Wrote: Picking up on ozthepoz's comments above, I think that there can actually be a very big difference between the 200 & 250.  I say can, rather than is, because this is very much speaker dependant.  With some speakers the difference appears to be non existent, I guess with speakers that provide easier loads.  However, I observed from my experience auditioning amps with the KEF Blades that the difference between what was then the 170 & 240 was huge, far more than you would expect from the delta in power.  It should be remembered that the different case for the 250 makes a huge difference in the cooling performance of the amp, which is in itself related to how the power supply reacts to load demands.  For me the difference was night and day in terms of dynamics and controll etc.

To be clear, I have no idea how this relates to driving ML's.  It's a case of things being rather more complex than you might think in the relationship between amplifier and any given speaker.
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#22
(15-Jan-2015, 00:13)chiphoust Wrote: I plan to auditoin the Sanders amps too, mainly based on your post.  I am looking at the ESL Mkii monoblocks.  Thoughts?


(14-Jan-2015, 23:18)Jwg1749 Wrote: I had a 200 Companion on home demo (paired with my own 200) at the same time as a Sanders Magtech power amp. The Magtech was so much better than the 400 at driving my ML Montis: I was shocked. I bought the Magtech. I do still think the Devialets are among the very best amps for driving electrodynamic speakers, just not for electrostatics.

Matt

I think the monoblocs will be brilliant but unnecessarily powerful. Overkill, if you like. The Magtech is the one to go for, as it has a better power supply than the ESL amps. It's also much cheaper.

Matt

Sonos Connect (W4S) > DSpeaker Antimode 2.0 > Sanders Magtech > Martin Logan Montis
Sonos Connect (W4S) > Devialet 200 > Vivid V1.5
Silver Phantoms (just the two)
London
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#23
(07-Jan-2015, 23:59)chiphoust Wrote: I am a newbie.  I hope this post is appropriate.  If not, someone please tell me.

I have Martin Logan Summit X's and have been wanting to substitue solidstate for my current Audio Research 200 watt mnonblocks and ARC preamp, with a Bryston BDA-2 DAC and MacMini running Amararra.

About 9 months ago, the local dealer brought in a Devialet 250 to audition on his store demo Summit X's.  He called me in to listen.  It was breathtaking.  In 40+ years of doing this, I had rarely, if ever, heard anything better.  My wife was there and heard the same.  All she wanted was a home audition.  Regrettable, the dealer had to send the demo 250 back and that was that.  No home auditoin.  No purchase.  7 months later the dealer advised that he had a D200 for me to home audition.  Off to the races, or so I thought.  It was nice, but not breathtaking.  It was a bit too forward and incisive in the upper midrange and treble, particularly female vocals.  To continue to quote Robert Harley's recent Absolute Sounds review:  It tended to "emplasize the harmonics of the strings rather than the instruments’ bodies. Cymbals were more prominent in the mix than through my reference amplifiers, and vocals had a touch of sibilance."  

It also seemd a bit flat and uninvolving.  I started getting fatigued about an hour into the listening session.  There was no toe tapping and no singing-a-long by the wife.  She was nonplussed.  It seemed like the D200 was straining to contend with the low impedance of the ML's at higher volumes.  One interesting thing of note:  I had to turn down the Summit X powered subwoofers to get proper bass balance.

I am now waiting for a D200 companion to arrive to see if that solves the issue.  It seemded to do it for Mr. Harley.  I hope I have the same experience.  I am told that the D400 configuration will stomp the D250 by itself.

I saw some ML Montis owners post about their positive experiences.  Please share any thoughts you might have.

Oh.. by the way I do not think it is the speakers cables.  They are Tranparent Reference, albeit the older XL technolgy.    

I also plan to hook up my old, but pristine, pair of B&W Signature 30's to see how those boxes do.  It should be wonderful.  For now though, the real issue is what to use to drive the Summit X's.  

I will post the results of the D400 audition in 2 weeks or so.

I did read your final post and am happy that D200 X 2 worked out. I hope you post again after you have had more time in the chair.
 I too wanted to simplify my gear and also to not buy a $3000+ DAC so I have a D200 that I borrowed from the dealer running right now with my Summits.  It is unbearable and will be going back tomorrow.  That said, I hooked it up to a couple of Opera Primas and it sounds amazing...big bass and a huge sound-stage in a large room.  I am not convinced these amps will get the best out of electrostatics.  My long and costly experience is that Martin Logans need lots of solid state power to sound their best and a good neutral tube pre-amp to keep digititus at bay.  Also, most amps with output transformers roll off the highs since they can't impedance match down to 0.6 ohms.
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