AIR

[warpeon]

I didn't think the power supply makes the difference because the bottleneck resides with devialet in the Weiss MAN301 case. No? If signal into devialet is clean, the "dirty" power inside devialet would contaminate the signal.

[Umetaro]

At least in theory, packet based data traffic with error detection and resending should provide perfect results in data transmission, making it superior to S/PDIF and USB. So anything external has an inferior
transmission route. This is partly why I'd really like to see UPnP/OpenHome support in Devialet itself.

What advantages are you seeking from UPnP/OpenHome over AIR? When AIR was not very stable, I expected the same thing. Now with stable AIR, I thought UPnP/OpenHome had no/little benefits. Of course, it would be nice for Devialet to support UPnP/OpenHome if resources are unlimited. However, given the limited resources at Devialet, I would expect Devialet to focus on sound quality improvement.

[GuillaumeB]

At least in theory, packet based data traffic with error detection and resending should provide perfect results in data transmission, making it superior to S/PDIF and USB. So anything external has an inferior
transmission route. This is partly why I'd really like to see UPnP/OpenHome support in Devialet itself.

What advantages are you seeking from UPnP/OpenHome over AIR? When AIR was not very stable, I expected the same thing. Now with stable AIR, I thought UPnP/OpenHome had no/little benefits. Of course, it would be nice for Devialet to support UPnP/OpenHome if resources are unlimited. However, given the limited resources at Devialet, I would expect Devialet to focus on sound quality improvement.

From my perspective UPnP helps me to simplify technology: I don't need to worry about computers, operating systems and software (well except when a new iOS comes along and my control apps don't work! ). I can access my music library at any time through my iPhone and iPad apps. I don't have to worry about my computer going to sleep, disconnecting from the network etc.

My music library is stored on a 4-bay NAS with RAID 5 (+1 additional backup) which gives me redundancy in the event of a hard disk failing. This has already happened to me once and it was relatively easy to restore. Apart from running occasional backups to the 4th drive I don't need to worry about it, everything just happens in the background. I occasionally copy everything to an external portable drive just to be safe though.

Now from a sound quality perspective I can only base this on some tests I carried out last year where I compared all the different inputs. At the time I found AIR to sound a little thin in comparison to USB and UPnP. Given that there have been a few software updates I should probably give it another go. I'm open-minded about this.

So for me it comes down to convenience, habit and sound preferences.

If I were starting from scratch I would probably put more time and effort into getting AIR to work, but I'd still want to be absolutely certain that I was getting the best sound quality possible out of the Devialet.

Guillaume

PS: I can also stream to two other locations in my house, accessing the same library from my iPhone or iPad.

[jjo]

What advantages are you seeking from UPnP/OpenHome over AIR? When AIR was not very stable, I expected the same thing. Now with stable AIR, I thought UPnP/OpenHome had no/little benefits.

It is a matter of preference, of course. If you have set up your system to your liking with AIR, it should be all you need. For me though, it's not that simple.

I'd rather not use a computer while really listening to music. So streaming from a laptop would be a no no. I could always set up a separate streaming computer and connect that directly to my Devialet, but I'd rather not have a computer in my HiFi rack, nor would I want to go through the trouble of configuring it to my liking, setting up remote control for all the apps I intend to use etc.

If I were to use a laptop, it would not have enough storage for my music collection anyway, so I'd have to use an external storage device, like my NAS. So if I'm using a NAS anyway, why use a middle man if I could stream directly to the device.

All and all, I'd just rather have something dedicated, low power, already configured to work for streaming (like an external UPnP streamer) than a computer. And eliminating the external bit, by having Devialet support it directly, would be wonderful.

Another reason is platform independence. AIR only supports the platforms Devialet has implemented it on. ATM it is Win, Mac, Android and iOS. Others will have nothing, whereas there are several UPnP/OpenHome control point implementations on various platforms and if there weren't, the specs are open and you could implement one yourself. Not the case with AIR though.

So given the limited resources of Devialet, I'd expect them not to support all the platforms separately, but have something that either works or can be made to work by others. Instead of just not giving a damn about linux/BSD/windows phone/sailfish/meego/bada/tizen/etc. users.

Also, if Devialet one day has, say financial trouble and is unable to continue the support of AIR on new versions of Win/Mac/Android/iOS, well the the AIR will just stop working on new versions of the platform, where as UPnP/OpenHome would just continue working.

Supporting operating systems at driver level is continuous work, not a one time deal like some alternatives.

[Umetaro]

jjo, thanks for your detailed explanation why you want UPnP/OpenHome. Sure it is a matter of preference. I agree.

Options are:
1) Use AIR with Mac/PC
2) Use a separate player such as Auralic Aries/SOtM sMS-100
3) Use NAS with USB audio output function such as Synology
4) Wait for Devialet's own UPnP/OpenHome support
I am leaning toward #1 option due to its simplicity, but open to any option if it offers better sound quality and usability.

On your point of avoiding a computer in a audio room, you don't have to place a Mac/PC in the HiFi rack. Mac/PC can be located in a separate room from an audio room as long as it is under the same network. For example, you can place a Mac/PC at the place your NAS is located (I guess your NAS is in a separate room). So a part of your issues can be solved. Further, NAS is a computer anyway although it is not OS X or Windows.

Another point

[GuillaumeB]

Since yesterday I've been experimenting with AIR. As most of you on here already know I'm a bit of a die-hard UPnP fan.

I did carry out a number of experiments with AIR last year but at the time was not impressed by the sound which had left me wanting. In short I had found the sound a bit thin and was also put off by the numerous dropouts I experienced at the time.

Given the numerous software upgrades since then I thought I should give it another go. This is what I tried:

Macbook AIR playing Audirvana > Draytek router > Cat7 > switch > AQ Diamond ethernet > Devialet.

I found it quite hard to get it working at first. Although this was probably down to inexperience... I kept messing around with the Audirvana and AIR settings and in the end the music just came on quite randomly!

Wow! I was immediately really surprised at how different it sounded to my MiND 180. Playing really familiar tracks I was struck by the difference in presentation. So different! The soundstage seemed much wider and the music seemed clearer and almost easier to follow. Better separation between instruments and air around vocals? At the same time I wondered if the music didn't sound a little bright at times. Then it occurred to me that this was the first time I was using the Devialet's ethernet interface...

There is a lot to like! So much so that I am currently still using AIR to stream from my Macbook which is in my study... compared to the MiND setup this is a real pain as I can't use my iPhone to select and play music. Also I am struggling a little with the AIR default format settings... it seems like I need to adjust these each time based on the format being played otherwise it can sound as though the chipmunks are on centre stage!

So I suppose I need to figure out a way of making this work properly... but a very promising start indeed! Will continue to test and report back later.

Guillaume

[Vivialet]

Hi Guillaume,
funny that you tried that now. I was already using the ethernet option since I upgraded to the new platform. I liked AIR via ethernet more than via wifi. Last weekend I tried the wifi option again to see if it has improved with the latest updates. And for me it really did. Now I'm using wifi again as I did with the D-Premier already. Maybe you should try this option as well, I think ethernet is slightly brighter sounding compared to wifi.

Bernie

[Kunter]

Since yesterday I've been experimenting with AIR. As most of you on here already know I'm a bit of a die-hard UPnP fan.

I did carry out a number of experiments with AIR last year but at the time was not impressed by the sound which had left me wanting. In short I had found the sound a bit thin and was also put off by the numerous dropouts I experienced at the time.

Given the numerous software upgrades since then I thought I should give it another go. This is what I tried:

Macbook AIR playing Audirvana > Draytek router > Cat7 > switch > AQ Diamond ethernet > Devialet.

I found it quite hard to get it working at first. Although this was probably down to inexperience... I kept messing around with the Audirvana and AIR settings and in the end the music just came on quite randomly!

Wow! I was immediately really surprised at how different it sounded to my MiND 180. Playing really familiar tracks I was struck by the difference in presentation. So different! The soundstage seemed much wider and the music seemed clearer and almost easier to follow. Better separation between instruments and air around vocals? At the same time I wondered if the music didn't sound a little bright at times. Then it occurred to me that this was the first time I was using the Devialet's ethernet interface...

There is a lot to like! So much so that I am currently still using AIR to stream from my Macbook which is in my study... compared to the MiND setup this is a real pain as I can't use my iPhone to select and play music. Also I am struggling a little with the AIR default format settings... it seems like I need to adjust these each time based on the format being played otherwise it can sound as though the chipmunks are on centre stage!

So I suppose I need to figure out a way of making this work properly... but a very promising start indeed! Will continue to test and report back later.

Guillaume

I told you
Try the ramdisk tweak with audirvana. Put the files on ram disk as wav (trust me) and then play with it.
And in its settings only the "use max buffer" setting should be enabled...

Looking forward to hear further comments...

Cheers...

[GuillaumeB]

Since yesterday I've been experimenting with AIR. As most of you on here already know I'm a bit of a die-hard UPnP fan.

I did carry out a number of experiments with AIR last year but at the time was not impressed by the sound which had left me wanting. In short I had found the sound a bit thin and was also put off by the numerous dropouts I experienced at the time.

Given the numerous software upgrades since then I thought I should give it another go. This is what I tried:

Macbook AIR playing Audirvana > Draytek router > Cat7 > switch > AQ Diamond ethernet > Devialet.

I found it quite hard to get it working at first. Although this was probably down to inexperience... I kept messing around with the Audirvana and AIR settings and in the end the music just came on quite randomly!

Wow! I was immediately really surprised at how different it sounded to my MiND 180. Playing really familiar tracks I was struck by the difference in presentation. So different! The soundstage seemed much wider and the music seemed clearer and almost easier to follow. Better separation between instruments and air around vocals? At the same time I wondered if the music didn't sound a little bright at times. Then it occurred to me that this was the first time I was using the Devialet's ethernet interface...

There is a lot to like! So much so that I am currently still using AIR to stream from my Macbook which is in my study... compared to the MiND setup this is a real pain as I can't use my iPhone to select and play music. Also I am struggling a little with the AIR default format settings... it seems like I need to adjust these each time based on the format being played otherwise it can sound as though the chipmunks are on centre stage!

So I suppose I need to figure out a way of making this work properly... but a very promising start indeed! Will continue to test and report back later.

Guillaume

I told you
Try the ramdisk tweak with audirvana. Put the files on ram disk as wav (trust me) and then play with it.
And in its settings only the "use max buffer" setting should be enabled...

Looking forward to hear further comments...

Cheers...

Cheers Kunter!

What is the ramdisk tweak? Settings are attached...

Guillaume

   

[Kunter]

What is the ramdisk tweak?

Guillaume

Settings should be ok. If you experience difficulties, clear the exclusive access mode as well...

for the ram disk...

first create a ram disk

http://bogner.sh/2012/12/os-x-create-a-r...-easy-way/

I would recommend a restart before doing this, so you do it when the memory is cleanest..

Initially 500 mb should be fine...

Select the file you want to listen to, in your case probably a flac, convert it to wav and then copy the Wav file into the ram disk...

From Audirvana (in playlist mode) select to add files, select the ram disk and the file inside, then play.

For comparison, you can also add the original flac file in your playlist, play them back to back to see (hear) the difference...

For conversion, I use XLD...

During playback, I would recommend disconnecting any usb disk from your system as their power supplies are the mother of evil...

Cheers

Kunter