Surround Sound vs Dolby Atmos vs Spatial Audio

[struts]

Lastly, I don't use the Home App so I have no first hand experience. I sometimes stream some Tidal tracks that have Atmos encoding from Roon (hosted on an iMac) to my Denon AVR via Airplay2 and that works. Whether you like the result (multi channel music) is of course a matter of taste. Strange that Apple would restrict that, but again I have no experience as I don't use that part of their echo system.

I think this makes sense.  There is a difference in the use cases we are describing which I suspect explains the difference.

In the scenario I describe the Apple TV is connected to the speakers so the Apple TV is performing the Atmos decoding, i.e. splitting the sound into the number and type of channels available in the room as declared in the Home app (currently 1 or 2).

In your scenario your Denon AVR is performing the Atmos decoding so the Apple TV is simply passing though the Atmos signal, essentially protocol converting it from Airplay 2 to HDMI, not decoding it.

I suspect that the limited horsepower of the Apple TV confines its use as a decoder to fairly trivial cases like 1.0.0 and 2.0.0, whereas passing through a signal requires much less horsepower and so a full Atmos signal can be supported.

So, back to my second post:

• Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K over HDMI but not over Airplay 2.
  
  

..should probably read "Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K when the two are connected via HDMI but not via Airplay 2."

[Drifter]

Lastly, I don't use the Home App so I have no first hand experience. I sometimes stream some Tidal tracks that have Atmos encoding from Roon (hosted on an iMac) to my Denon AVR via Airplay2 and that works. Whether you like the result (multi channel music) is of course a matter of taste. Strange that Apple would restrict that, but again I have no experience as I don't use that part of their echo system.

I think this makes sense.  There is a difference in the use cases we are describing which I suspect explains the difference.

In the scenario I describe the Apple TV is connected to the speakers so the Apple TV is performing the Atmos decoding, i.e. splitting the sound into the number and type of channels available in the room as declared in the Home app (currently 1 or 2).

In your scenario your Denon AVR is performing the Atmos decoding so the Apple TV is simply passing though the Atmos signal, essentially protocol converting it from Airplay 2 to HDMI, not decoding it.

I suspect that the limited horsepower of the Apple TV confines its use as a decoder to fairly trivial cases like 1.0.0 and 2.0.0, whereas passing through a signal requires much less horsepower and so a full Atmos signal can be supported.

So, back to my second post:

• Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K over HDMI but not over Airplay 2.
  
  

..should probably read "Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K when the two are connected via HDMI but not via Airplay 2."

That is a good explanation and it is makes sense.

[struts]

It would be brilliant to get some sound impressions for the following 3 scenarios:
- Atmos signal decoded by the Dione using Atmos
- 5.1 signal decoded by the Dione using SPACE
- stereo signal decoded by the Dione using SPACE

It would be be even better if the source material (i.e. movie) is the same just with 3 different audio tracks. You can then use the same scene in the movie and explain how the sound changes between the 3 scenarios.

That would be awesome ....

+1!!!   That is exactly what I would like to do as soon as I can get the opportunity to audition one.  Maybe I'll just order one although right now they seem to be on pre-order with delivery first at the end of the month.

Btw, "patented" is back!  Maybe it never went away but I was just looking at a different page?  I took a screenshot just to convince myself I am not losing it..

   

Still can't find any trace of the patent online, although it occurs to me that they just say it is patented, not that they own the patent.  So it could be that they are licensing someone else's IP here.  Maybe Dolby Surround? 

[struts]

Lastly, I don't use the Home App so I have no first hand experience. I sometimes stream some Tidal tracks that have Atmos encoding from Roon (hosted on an iMac) to my Denon AVR via Airplay2 and that works. Whether you like the result (multi channel music) is of course a matter of taste. Strange that Apple would restrict that, but again I have no experience as I don't use that part of their echo system.

I think this makes sense.  There is a difference in the use cases we are describing which I suspect explains the difference.

In the scenario I describe the Apple TV is connected to the speakers so the Apple TV is performing the Atmos decoding, i.e. splitting the sound into the number and type of channels available in the room as declared in the Home app (currently 1 or 2).

In your scenario your Denon AVR is performing the Atmos decoding so the Apple TV is simply passing though the Atmos signal, essentially protocol converting it from Airplay 2 to HDMI, not decoding it.

I suspect that the limited horsepower of the Apple TV confines its use as a decoder to fairly trivial cases like 1.0.0 and 2.0.0, whereas passing through a signal requires much less horsepower and so a full Atmos signal can be supported.

So, back to my second post:

• Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K over HDMI but not over Airplay 2.
  
  

..should probably read "Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K when the two are connected via HDMI but not via Airplay 2."

This all makes me realise that the Dione probably can play Atmos content via Airplay 2 since it is acting as both the decoder and the renderer (speakers).  

@Shulaf.  Are you able to confirm this?  Are you able to stream Atmos content directly to the Dione via Airplay 2 and confirm that it is being rendered as 5.1.2 Atmos?

[Shulaf]

Lastly, I don't use the Home App so I have no first hand experience. I sometimes stream some Tidal tracks that have Atmos encoding from Roon (hosted on an iMac) to my Denon AVR via Airplay2 and that works. Whether you like the result (multi channel music) is of course a matter of taste. Strange that Apple would restrict that, but again I have no experience as I don't use that part of their echo system.

I think this makes sense.  There is a difference in the use cases we are describing which I suspect explains the difference.

In the scenario I describe the Apple TV is connected to the speakers so the Apple TV is performing the Atmos decoding, i.e. splitting the sound into the number and type of channels available in the room as declared in the Home app (currently 1 or 2).

In your scenario your Denon AVR is performing the Atmos decoding so the Apple TV is simply passing though the Atmos signal, essentially protocol converting it from Airplay 2 to HDMI, not decoding it.

I suspect that the limited horsepower of the Apple TV confines its use as a decoder to fairly trivial cases like 1.0.0 and 2.0.0, whereas passing through a signal requires much less horsepower and so a full Atmos signal can be supported.

So, back to my second post:

• Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K over HDMI but not over Airplay 2.
  
  

..should probably read "Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K when the two are connected via HDMI but not via Airplay 2."

This all makes me realise that the Dione probably can play Atmos content via Airplay 2 since it is acting as both the decoder and the renderer (speakers).  

@Shulaf.  Are you able to confirm this?  Are you able to stream Atmos content directly to the Dione via Airplay 2 and confirm that it is being rendered as 5.1.2 Atmos?

Confirmed it works just tested, I used the Dolby testing tracks from Apple Music.

https://music.apple.com/nl/album/functio...1608035851

Every channel is mapped correctly to the speaker


Verzonden vanaf mijn iPhone met Tapatalk

[struts]

Confirmed it works just tested, I used the Dolby testing tracks from Apple Music.

https://music.apple.com/nl/album/functio...1608035851

Every channel is mapped correctly to the speaker


Verzonden vanaf mijn iPhone met Tapatalk

Thanks @Shulaf! Almost(!) starting to feel I am starting to understand this now. Dang, this surround sound thing is like an onion. Every layer I peel away just reveals another one..

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[eniriop]

I think this makes sense.  There is a difference in the use cases we are describing which I suspect explains the difference.

In the scenario I describe the Apple TV is connected to the speakers so the Apple TV is performing the Atmos decoding, i.e. splitting the sound into the number and type of channels available in the room as declared in the Home app (currently 1 or 2).

In your scenario your Denon AVR is performing the Atmos decoding so the Apple TV is simply passing though the Atmos signal, essentially protocol converting it from Airplay 2 to HDMI, not decoding it.

I suspect that the limited horsepower of the Apple TV confines its use as a decoder to fairly trivial cases like 1.0.0 and 2.0.0, whereas passing through a signal requires much less horsepower and so a full Atmos signal can be supported.

So, back to my second post:

• Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K over HDMI but not over Airplay 2.
  
  

..should probably read "Dione can render Dolby Atmos content from an Apple TV 4K when the two are connected via HDMI but not via Airplay 2."

This all makes me realise that the Dione probably can play Atmos content via Airplay 2 since it is acting as both the decoder and the renderer (speakers).  

@Shulaf.  Are you able to confirm this?  Are you able to stream Atmos content directly to the Dione via Airplay 2 and confirm that it is being rendered as 5.1.2 Atmos?

Confirmed it works just tested, I used the Dolby testing tracks from Apple Music.

https://music.apple.com/nl/album/functio...1608035851

Every channel is mapped correctly to the speaker


Verzonden vanaf mijn iPhone met Tapatalk

Are you sure ? Here is what the Dione white paper says:
"It is important to note that given the high bandwidth of object-based audio format, it is
necessary to use the HDMI input to enjoy Dolby Atmos content."
If it is Atmos, then it says so on the Devialet App under the volume control for the Dione. If it says LPCM it is not Atmos. I have never had Atmos on the Devialet app when playing through Airplay 2  Atmos Apple music files.