AIR not yet compatible with Yosemite for MAC

[GuillaumeB]

Yes.

You have to take care.

As you rightly say Dev' have integrated AIR into iTunes so you will only get bit-perfect via AIR if you use iTunes.

Also if you are using USB then you need to install an app such as "BitPerfect" which works with iTunes to ensure that it doesn't pop-back to 16/44 when playing high re audio files.

Rik

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I can feel a new topic coming on.

"A Simple guide to getting the best out of your Dev' with a Mac Mini"

Rik

I should add that my conversation with Thierry was about using AIR on a Mac, we didn't discuss PCs. I'm pretty sure these can output bit perfect using WASAPI.

Personally (and this is entirely subjective of course!) I believe the best sound quality is achieved when you use something that is built and optimised specifically for audio (both hardware and software). We see it all the time with the tweaks that are going on on this forum. I also don't think it's a coincidence that the Devialet sounds fantastic when being fed by a decent CD transport, I believe both Audio Research and Metronome ones were being used at the last Guildford Audio show. In particular the Metronome sounded especially good when connected to a D800.

Anyway this is going way off topic.

Rik - pls go ahead and set up that thread though. I think it's an excellent idea.

Guillaume

[Antoine]

They told me that JRiver WASAPI was bit perfect via AIR???!!.......

On Windows everything that plays through WASAPI -in exclusive mode- is.

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A more general statement, also in response to Guillaume's post above; Kunter wrote it earlier: computer audio is easy, getting great/the best sound from a computer is the hard part. And I fully agree with him. Of course purpose built music playback hardware (like CD players, streamers etc.) usually sounds at it's best out of the box without the (real) need for it's user to tweak and fiddle much.

For anyone exploring or building an -optimised- music server, be it based on Windows or Mac, avoiding AIR and using USB will get you better results. If you use a regular PC/Mac without any tuning/care to playback optimization I still think AIR ethernet is better. WiFi in my opinion should be avoided completely unless you live somewhere without any close neighbors.

O, personal opinion, Mac Mini is relatively expensive and difficult to optimize. I myself would never choose that solution. General, but carefully selected hardware will outperform the Mac mini, with a bigger bang for the buck, and do it easier. If you don't want to chase the best SQ possible and want a drop in, small, esthetically most 'correct' lifestyle kind of product then Mac Mini is your choice but don't expect it to outperform a purpose built streamer like, for example, an Aries or any optimized computer music server.

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I can feel a new topic coming on.

"A Simple guide to getting the best out of your Dev' with a Mac Mini"

Rik

Let me save you and others the work! See:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-mu...tep-17666/

[Confused]

For anyone exploring or building an -optimised- music server, be it based on Windows or Mac, avoiding AIR and using USB will get you better results. If you use a regular PC/Mac without any tuning/care to playback optimization I still think AIR ethernet is better. WiFi in my opinion should be avoided completely unless you live somewhere without any close neighbors.

An interesting comment re the USB input outperforming wired Ethernet (with optimised front end). I have seen similar comments previously. The question is why? This puzzles me slightly.

[Antoine]

I'm not sure as to the why myself. It looks like AIR is perfect for non-optimized systems (and give you say 85% regardless of the system used or how it's configured) but can become a bottleneck at a certain point in time when you're making the optimizations. I've only realized/experienced this myself over the last few weeks but was surprised that I wasn't getting the results others (not Devialet users) did and it turned out switching to USB lifted these "restrictions".

A lot is written about why optimizing a PC/Mac helps improve SQ. But no one can really explain this for the full 100%. A lot of it seems to boil down to a need for an optimized power delivery (as clean as possible, with separation of/dedicated power to, for example the power to a SSD or USB interface) and a low latency almost real-time connection to a DAC and a computer that performs the least amount of concurrent tasks and processes. AIR is anything but 'real-time'/low latency so perhaps this is a possible reason. (just a thought)

[thumb5]

AIR is anything but 'real-time'/low latency so perhaps this is a possible reason. (just a thought)

But the large buffer on the Devialet surely isolates the time-critical part (audio playback) from the vagaries of whatever is happening on the host computer and in the network, doesn't it? And with wireless AIR you also don't have any possible dependency on Ethernet cables to (possibly) inject noise into the ground plane, or whatever else they might do. So purely theoretically I'd expect AIR to sound similarly good independent of the host.

What seems harder to explain on technical grounds is why USB should sound better than AIR. Dare I say it: maybe it's cable sensitivity by the same token (no pun intended!) as wired AIR?

[Antoine]

On a purely theoretical level I fully agree with what you wrote Thumb5 but in practice I experience things that don't always coincide with those views. I have *no (conclusive) idea* why. And although I find these matters incredibly fascinating, in the end it's the result that matters.

It's not only the (USB) cable that makes a difference. For example me introducing JPlay into my own playback chain changed the sound with the same cable present. Lot's of people experience the(se) same kind of changes. All I know is that the USB link is incredibly low latency; I've tweaked it to the maximum, the USB buffer is only 1 (!!) sample now which JPlay calls 'direct link'.

[PhilP]

Let me save you and others the work! See:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-mu...tep-17666/

I great link but you'd have to be out of your mind to do what tranz is suggesting. Better to build your own music server as Antoine and Kunter have done. I'm sure it would be less work and a lot cheaper

Some of the modifications in the CA thread probably will have an impact on sound if you're using USB but I would guess that few would have any affect if you're using AIR?

Many of us would like to use Mac mini's or similar in our systems so that we have a choice of music library mgt and player s/w, want to use streaming services like Qobuz, have an easy way to do back-ups and have someone to call if things go wrong. Also many of us surprisingly don't want to get into computer DIY . It would be useful to this audience if anyone has non-invasive tips for improving sound from a Mac mini.

Perhaps using SSD rather than an internal HDD, adding a mains power conditioner (if they work bi-directionally as Guillaume has mentioned elsewhere) and disabling wi-fi would be good tweaks to try first?

[thumb5]

And although I find these matters incredibly fascinating, in the end it's the result that matters.

Antoine, yes I agree completely. I didn't mean to sound argumentative, just curious.

[Eddye]

Just updated my mac's to Yosemite. Audirvana 1.5.12 works fine, so no AIR for me until Devialet updates the app.

[Antoine]

And although I find these matters incredibly fascinating, in the end it's the result that matters.

Antoine, yes I agree completely. I didn't mean to sound argumentative, just curious.

Hi Thumb5, thanks, and I also only meant to say that although I found some popular optimizations I read about to be 'questionable' in theory, I tried them anyway and only judged the result.

I think we all, at some time, have thought "how can it be possible that a power cable improve the SQ of my device" (for example, but you could also substitute power cable for network or USB cable I guess) and then tried it and were surprised by the results. Computer audio is a somewhat newer territory (at least for me) with the same kind of surprises.

'Everything matters' is a phrase I see regularly at computeraudiophile and it does seem to hold a lot of merit.