Air, sub, HC, SAM

[sergii85]

Hello! I'm a new user of Devialet 220 pro and after a long reading on this forum still have a couple questions.

1. I have a REL sub and want to connect it with high level input, but also I have a receiver for movies and front speakers connected as pre-out so Devialet can control them. My question is when I watching the movies with my receiver can I just unplug a Speakon Neutrik from my REL sub and leave it connected with my receiver so the sound on the sub will comes from receiver as a sub out according to the channels in the soundtrack. When the receiver is off I will just plug in a Speakon and listen the music with high level input for sub? Will it work this way?

2. If I conect the sub with high level input SAM should be off?

3. What is the best way to reproduce the music? Roon, AIR, UPnP or laptop connected with USB cable?

4. What is the best way to connect Devialet to my TV? I watch the concerts from my NAS and before the sound comes via HDMI to my receiver, but now front speakers connected to Devialet. Should I connect my TV to Devialet with optical cable or the sound will be better if I leave it as before? HDMI to receiver and with pre-out to Devialet?

Thank you in advance to all who can help with my questions.

[devianet]

Very close to my own situation, I have experience with most of the setup possibilities.

You can't use the high level (i.e. speaker level) connection on the REL, with the Expert, if you want to use SAM. With SAM, you have to use the low-level connection on the REL driven by the (mono) pre-out on the Expert. This enables you to use SAM because SAM will be on the speaker-level, only, not on the pre-out. IMO, this is absolutely the way to go. SAM with your mains will enable you to set the low pass filter lower (either on the REL or in the configurator) and increase the bass level to get the best reinforcement of the lowest frequencies.

So how do you get the HT bass then? Two options.

1. You can set your HT receiver to have no subwoofer and send all the LFE bass to the front mains, which should be set as large. When this reaches the Expert, the extreme bass will be filtered away from the speakers (SAM cone excursion protection is really good for this) but not your sub. This works surprisingly well but I strongly recommend using SAM for this setup just for the woofer protection.

2. Better but this needs use of a second low-level input on the REL. RELs normally have multiple inputs which can be used in parallel. Connect your HT receiver sub out directly to this input (leaving the Expert connected to the other) and reconfigure your HT receiver to have a subwoofer and to not route LFE bass to the front mains. Optionally, you may also wish to configure it to route normal bass away from the front mains and to the subwoofer, but probably not. Set the levels to balance the Expert perfectly first, then use the subwoofer level in the HT receiver to balance that. This is the setup I use myself and is my opinion the best. The bass for both 2-channel and HT is uncompromised due to the dedicated LFE routing and SAM.

For reproduction of music I would definitely go digitally into the Expert and not via the HT receiver.

For TV audio I would recommend going via the HT receiver because of the multi-channel possibilities. Toslink optical is good, but you'll be limited to basic surround decoding. Via HDMI, higher-bitrate options become possible. Clearly then pre-out to Expert for the front 2 channels.

[sergii85]

Very close to my own situation, I have experience with most of the setup possibilities.

You can't use the high level (i.e. speaker level) connection on the REL, with the Expert, if you want to use SAM. With SAM, you have to use the low-level connection on the REL driven by the (mono) pre-out on the Expert. This enables you to use SAM because SAM will be on the speaker-level, only, not on the pre-out. IMO, this is absolutely the way to go. SAM with your mains will enable you to set the low pass filter lower (either on the REL or in the configurator) and increase the bass level to get the best reinforcement of the lowest frequencies.

So how do you get the HT bass then? Two options.

1. You can set your HT receiver to have no subwoofer and send all the LFE bass to the front mains, which should be set as large. When this reaches the Expert, the extreme bass will be filtered away from the speakers (SAM cone excursion protection is really good for this) but not your sub. This works surprisingly well but I strongly recommend using SAM for this setup just for the woofer protection.

2. Better but this needs use of a second low-level input on the REL. RELs normally have multiple inputs which can be used in parallel. Connect your HT receiver sub out directly to this input (leaving the Expert connected to the other) and reconfigure your HT receiver to have a subwoofer and to not route LFE bass to the front mains. Optionally, you may also wish to configure it to route normal bass away from the front mains and to the subwoofer, but probably not. Set the levels to balance the Expert perfectly first, then use the subwoofer level in the HT receiver to balance that. This is the setup I use myself and is my opinion the best. The bass for both 2-channel and HT is uncompromised due to the dedicated LFE routing and SAM.

For reproduction of music I would definitely go digitally into the Expert and not via the HT receiver.

For TV audio I would recommend going via the HT receiver because of the multi-channel possibilities. Toslink optical is good, but you'll be limited to basic surround decoding. Via HDMI, higher-bitrate options become possible. Clearly then pre-out to Expert for the front 2 channels.

Thank you very much for your answer. I thought about this option, but everybody says that high level input is better that's why I decided to try it that way.
But if you say that it works well with SAM and low level will try it.
One more question. Is there any possibility to make Devialet to turn on with the volume level 0 db and Line input when I turn my receiver on??

[devianet]

"Everybody", or probably 99% of them, don't have SAM, so have much less of a reason to try the low level input.

I do recommend trying it both ways and seeing which you like. That's what I did before reaching my conclusions. But the optimal level and low pass filter settings are very different with SAM, so worth taking the time to really get each possibility dialled in properly - can't really A/B it. And your sub will probably make ample use of its protection feature if you accidentally try to run it via the high-level inputs with SAM.

With SAM+sub I start with the sub off and get SAM dialled in as best I can. This takes a little time as extended bass seems to take a little "getting used to" in any given room - and is typically set too high a level initially! I then use the normal REL setup process to bring the sub up so that it's almost inaudible in the SAM range but fills in gently below that, switching it on and off via the Expert remote to A/B the level. The key - as per classic REL advice - is setting a low LPF frequency, which I find by playing test frequencies to check for smoothness across the lowest octaves.

I currently use the Studio III with the Magico S1MkII in a medium-sized room. The LPF is set at 27Hz. For music, there is almost no need of the sub with this speaker with SAM, but it adds the final massive "slam" and "heft" which eludes this modestly-sized floorstander when compared to larger and heavier speakers such as the Magico A5.

I don't have experience with the automation question but I remember that it has been addressed elsewhere here. I think the trigger input and/or the serial input can do this.

[sergii85]

Thank you, Devianet.
One more question. When I use devialet with receiver the correct volume level on devialet is 0 dB, but when I pause the movie after some time it is automatically low the volume to -16 dB. Do you know if I can turn it off to have always the same volume?
Also, maybe somebody knows the web page or can give me the link where explains all the menus options and adjustments?

[ada]

Probably you have the power saving configuration enabled in the configuratior. There is a power saving function that will automatically decrease the volume to pre-configured value after the timer is met on idle.

   

[sergii85]

Probably you have the power saving configuration enabled in the configuratior. There is a power saving function that will automatically decrease the volume to pre-configured value after the timer is met on idle.

Thank you, ada. After your post I took a look again on configurator and found a couple more useful functions. Also read about ICM and DPM. Most recommendations is to turn off this functions, but I tried ICM and when I watch the movie I like this sound with ICM on. The rest of modes and options will try to listen the difference and trust to my ear. Do you know what is the difference between 4 filters when you config your amp on the web page?

[devianet]

I assume you mean the "order" of the filter, 1st/2nd/3rd/4th order?

This relates to the steepness of the rolloff for the low-pass filter. So, as the frequency rises above the nominal "crossover frequency", how quickly - in decibels per octave - will the notes the subwoofer play get very quiet and then inaudible. The higher the order, the steeper the rolloff.

Generally you want a fairly steep rolloff, for two reasons 1) you don't want the sub to be playing any notes higher than it has to, in the mid-bass region, because your main speakers will be better at this and 2) your main speakers, especially if they are ported, will form a high-pass filter which will also roll off quite steeply. Thus, to create an even response in the crossover musical region you want a progressive handover from the main speakers to the subwoofer as the pitch descends. But RELs have their own low pass filter too, with - depending on the model - less flexibility on the order of the rolloff, and whether or not it is actually engaged on a particular input.

But the key is trial and testing. I find a signal generator, and a set of known tracks with substantial infra bass content, invaluable. One can literally go note by note in the bottom octave (16Hz - 32Hz). It takes a while to get it right for the room and for your tastes, but it's a fabulous thing when you get there and you can enjoy the results of your labours with every track.

[sergii85]

Finally, I've made my choice. As for me, hi level input sounds better. The difference not only in frequency response, but in character, punch and how it sounds. With hi level input it sounds more seamless and soft. When I connected to Devialet sub out I've tried all 4 orders of filters and the sound changes significantly, so one of them I saved for listening heavy music because it sounds more punchy. But for jazz and classical music I will use a hi level input. Anyway, both connections are good, many adjustments and expirements can be done and as I discovered for my listening I can use both of them depending on the music style. Thank you for your help and recommendations.