Coaxial RCA input supports DSD64 DoP?

[cescrig]

A direct quote from the White Paper: "The entire Expert range is now compatible with the DoP protocol (DSD over PCM). This new feature is available through the USB input but also on the digital XLR input (AES/EBU), the TOSLINK optical input, and all coaxial digital inputs (S/PDIF). A completely unique feature."
The answer to the question is clear then. Will it work?

The thing is, I want to continue using my SACD collection, and I've thought about using an audio extractor (Geer Fab Audio D.BOB) to output a DSD64 signal via DoP or PCM 24/176.4 via HDMI from a Denon DVD player, and then sending that signal from the extractor to the Expert 440 Prio Dual via its RCA input. Does anyone have experience with this?

Another possibility (more expensive) is to use an SACD transport that has a high-definition RCA output. I've found two:
YBA Design YT302
Onix Zenith XST20
Both output a high-definition digital RCA signal that we could use with the Expert. That's all on paper, but does it work?

[ray1234]

A direct quote from the White Paper: "The entire Expert range is now compatible with the DoP protocol (DSD over PCM). This new feature is available through the USB input but also on the digital XLR input (AES/EBU), the TOSLINK optical input, and all coaxial digital inputs (S/PDIF). A completely unique feature."
The answer to the question is clear then. Will it work?

The thing is, I want to continue using my SACD collection, and I've thought about using an audio extractor (Geer Fab Audio D.BOB) to output a DSD64 signal via DoP or PCM 24/176.4 via HDMI from a Denon DVD player, and then sending that signal from the extractor to the Expert 440 Prio Dual via its RCA input. Does anyone have experience with this?

Another possibility (more expensive) is to use an SACD transport that has a high-definition RCA output. I've found two:
YBA Design YT302
Onix Zenith XST20
Both output a high-definition digital RCA signal that we could use with the Expert. That's all on paper, but does it work?

I have used a DDC to output SPDIF coaxial to my Devialet D400 and DSD 64 works, so I think on Devialet's part there is no problem.

For SACD, I am not sure your Denon DVD player will output the actual DSD bitstream, because there is a copyright protect that prevents players from doing so. There are only a couple of Bluray players with MediaTek chipset that allows ripping of SACD because of a bug in the chipset. I don't think ripping can be done with your so called "audio extractor" software alone.

The two SACD players you mentioned are able to output actual DSD signal, I believe PS Audio is the player other than the two that can do so as well.

[Peter van der Laarse]

I own an Oppo 105D and an Oppo 103EU since 2015 and I use them both to copy SACD's in 5.0 and 5.1 DSD format for years now. I now own 2.250 surround SACD's in native DSD format (thanks to free Dutch libraries). The only surround processor I know of who can play 8 channels native DSD is coming from Canada: Exasound S88 (ca. € 7.000, via internet only). The Devialet can play DSD in stereo of course and this is by far the best quality you can have (Devialet is 40 bits internarly). My NUC translates the DSD 5.1 stream into 24/192 HDMI into the Oppo HDMI INPUT (No Bla ray player exists anymore with an HDMI INPUT, brrrr) and it sounds beautiful. But native should be even better.....

[cescrig]

Thanks for the replies to my post. It's clear the answer to the question is a resounding YES.

I've ruled out the solution of playing SACDs with high-resolution RCA coaxial SACD players: the Shanling Onix Zenith XST20 and the YBA YT302. The Head-Fi.com forum mentions that both operate without gapless playback when playing SACDs, and that it's an unsolvable hardware problem. That's unacceptable.

I'm going to try an alternative solution that seems to avoid this problem and is cheaper. Since my Denon DVD player is old, I'm going to use a Sony UBP-X1100ES as the source and the GeerFab D.BOB HDMI audio extractor. With this combination, I should get DSD64 via DoP over coaxial RCA.

I'll share my experience with this soon. Happy New Year 2026.

PS: By the way, Peter, can you provide more information on "free Dutch libraries"?

[cescrig]

As I mentioned before, I use a Sony UBP-X1100ES as my SACD and CD source and the GeerFab D.BOB HDMI audio extractor. With this combination, I get DSD64 via DoP over RCA coaxial. And it works wonderfully, without any gaps, unlike what happens with other SACD players (Shaling and YBA), according to what I've read on the Head-Fi forum.

[rsegato]

As I mentioned before, I use a Sony UBP-X1100ES as my SACD and CD source and the GeerFab D.BOB HDMI audio extractor. With this combination, I get DSD64 via DoP over RCA coaxial. And it works wonderfully, without any gaps, unlike what happens with other SACD players (Shaling and YBA), according to what I've read on the Head-Fi forum.

interesting thread on dsd64 via DoP over coax 

fyi...in case anyone is interested in same digital path into hdmi...
I can stream DSD64 from my Nuc HDMI output directly into my devialet hdmi input (only the D-Premier has this input format (HDMI 1.3 I believe)
... Roon shows the attached signal path for DSD 64 showing
... processing is within devialet at 176.4 kHz
... DSD64 also plays direct from my Oppo105 output

(note hdmi input has dead silent background)

[Dougiet]

It’s my understanding that the Devialet converts internally any incoming DSD signal to PCM! The signal might arrive via DoP as DSD, but that’s as far as it goes. Even though the display shows a DSD signal, the Devialet is just showing the correct flag reading via DoP. Or am l wrong here 🧐?

[cescrig]

It’s my understanding that the Devialet converts internally any incoming DSD signal to PCM! The signal might arrive via DoP as DSD, but that’s as far as it goes. Even though the display shows a DSD signal, the Devialet is just showing the correct flag reading via DoP. Or am l wrong here 🧐?

I see it that way too.
But we're fortunate that the Devialet has an extraordinary DAC, even though the Texas Instruments chip is ten years old.
DACs with the latest generation chips don't have the Devialet's DAC architecture, and even if they play DSD 256 (there's a lot of marketing about that), I don't think they'll improve on the Expert's sound with its exquisite PCM signal processing.
By the way, what about the T8? I have an A8 and I'm delighted with it, but I was thinking of replacing it with an A8 since I don't use its DAC or preamp. I've read that the T8's transformer hums a bit; is that true?

[ray1234]

It’s my understanding that the Devialet converts internally any incoming DSD signal to PCM! The signal might arrive via DoP as DSD, but that’s as far as it goes. Even though the display shows a DSD signal, the Devialet is just showing the correct flag reading via DoP. Or am l wrong here 🧐?

Theoretically it is correct, it all goes back to PCM at the end. However, DSD does sound a bit more mellow comparing the same song on PCM on my Devialet Expert 400, of course there is no way to direct compare as the mixing on SACD is already different from the mixing on CD. In any case, being able to play DSD direct already widens the universe of files that you can play, although Devialet is still not able to play higher spec DSD128 or DSD256.

[cescrig]

Dougiet
Theoretically it is correct, it all goes back to PCM at the end. However, DSD does sound a bit more mellow comparing the same song on PCM on my Devialet Expert 400, of course there is no way to direct compare as the mixing on SACD is already different from the mixing on CD. In any case, being able to play DSD direct already widens the universe of files that you can play, although Devialet is still not able to play higher spec DSD128 or DSD256.

I'm not worried that it can't read DSD files larger than 64. I use JRiver to convert 128 and 256 files to 64, and that works fine. I used to have a McIntosh C53 preamp that supported those formats, and I confess there's no (or at least I don't notice) better sound quality, although the file sizes are considerably larger. That's why, I'll say it again, the Expert's DAC is far superior to others with more format support. I'm convinced that with current 24/192 streaming, the sound quality is unbeatable. Nothing more is needed.