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Phantom I Longevity - Investment for the Future?
#1
Hey Guys  Cool
I've got a question before purchasing two Devialet Phantom I 108 DB Speakers (I have the opportunity to get two of them for 3700€).  
Is there any reason to fear that the speakers fail on me during the next 20 years or so?  Huh
For me as a student this is a huge investment and I'm nervous about the longevity of the speakers. 
Ideally I want to buy something great now and take them with me wherever I'm moving to in my lifetime. 
Are there any parts in the system I have to be worried about regarding Hard-/Software?

I'm grateful for all your answers. 
Thanks! 

PS: What do you think of the deal, getting two Phantom I Gold (108 DB) first Generation + Treestands + Devialet Dialog for 3700 Euro?
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#2
I would say there is every chance they will fail within ten years let alone 20. I am on my second pair within six years.
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#3
If you want something that lasts for 20 years, do not buy a non repairable speaker controlled by an app. If the hardware doesn't fail, the software support will be long gone after 20 years.
Living room: Kii Three/BXT with Control.
Den: Tannoy Precision 8 iDP with TS112 iDP subwoofer.
In the cupboard, waiting for a sibling: 1st gen. Phantom Silver running DOS1
My Phantom Voyage
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#4
(20-Jan-2022, 19:07)newone97 Wrote: Hey Guys  Cool
I've got a question before purchasing two Devialet Phantom I 108 DB Speakers (I have the opportunity to get two of them for 3700€).  
Is there any reason to fear that the speakers fail on me during the next 20 years or so?  Huh
For me as a student this is a huge investment and I'm nervous about the longevity of the speakers. 
Ideally I want to buy something great now and take them with me wherever I'm moving to in my lifetime. 
Are there any parts in the system I have to be worried about regarding Hard-/Software?

I'm grateful for all your answers. 
Thanks! 

PS: What do you think of the deal, getting two Phantom I Gold (108 DB) first Generation + Treestands + Devialet Dialog for 3700 Euro?

Interesting question.  I would say to answer it you need to look at three factors:

1. Company longevity (how likely is the company to be around in 20 years to service and protect resale value?)
2. Product quality (how likely is it to fail in the next 20 years?)
3. Product relevance (how likely is it to still be relevant or even usable in 20 years?)

I would argue that the answer to 1 is pure guesswork.  I do not have insights into Devialet's finances but the impression I get is that their investments in marketing outpace their investments in R&D.  Marketing is important, but this is a company founded and profiled on innovation so it is important that they continue to invent new products and/or enhance old ones. My impression at least is that the rate of those inventions/enhancements has decreased over the last few years.  As to how long they will continue to offer service for these products, that is also a bit of an imponderable.  The trickle of firmware updates for the Expert range has pretty much dried up whereas Phantom continues to receive enhancements, even to the oldest units. And in cases of irreparability or obsolescence Devialet's track record so far has generally been to offer discounted trade-ins, to newer models, so factor that in.

Product quality is a hard one to judge.  The products certainly appear to be well made from a hardware perspective although serviceability is poor and field repair is extremely difficult to impossible, pointing back to the answer to 1 above.   I have owned 3 generations of Experts and two generations of Phantoms and never had a hardware failure, but others here have.  On the other hand software and firmware problems have been rife and even when Devialet solves them new ones can be created when parts of the replay chain outside their control (etc. Spotify, Airplay, Roon) change and break things.  My prediction is that this will continue to be a minefield going forwards although you may be able to mitigate problems to some degree by at least ensuring the two speakers you are pairing have the same hardware configuration.  Ensure the first three characters of the serial numbers, a letter and two digits, are the same.

Finally product relevance.  This is an area where you don't need to do any guesswork to see a pile of risk.  Just the fact that the Phantoms contain digital circuitry puts a very finite life expectancy on them.  Check out state-of-the-art digital products from 20 years ago and look how relevant they are today.  20 years ago I owned a dCS Elgar DAC, a very expensive product generally viewed as state-of-the-art.  Yet it had no USB input, no Ethernet input and no support for Roon, so even ignoring the sound quality superiority of my current Ayre QX-5 DAC a dCS Elgar simply doesn't do what I want it to do in 2022 and as such is pretty much obsolete.  Phantoms contain digital hardware such as DAC chips, Wi-fi chips, HomePlug chips, Ethernet ports etc. which are not software upgradable.  So even if Devialet continues to update the software and firmware to maintain compatibility with current and new sources and add functionality long into the future the Phantoms will still almost certainly be obsolete in twenty years.  They will still, in the best case, do what they do now - but there is a very good chance that what they do now will simply no longer be (as) relevant in 20 years' time.

So I think the bottom line is if you want speakers that will still be as relevant in 20 years' time don't look at the state of the (digital) art, look at "classic".  A pair of LS3/5As will be exactly as relevant in 20 years, probably still sound as good, and may even hold onto their value pretty well too.  That is what I would call an "investment" in audio terms.  The Phantoms, as much as I love mine, are pure consumption.

Good luck!
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#5
Thanks for this detailed answer!!!
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#6
I would go for something like the Cabasse Pearl if you want something similar in looks and repairable, quite rare although there are a pair for £3500 on pinkfishmedia. I have nothing to do with the sale but the seller is safe.Very tempted myself.
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