Sub options?

[teddlesdee]

As mentioned in an earlier thread, I have set about recommissioning my 440 for xmas...

The 440s drive my Big, black Triangle Delta speakers which are fab and have a very wide range, but occasionally its nice to experience some more OOOMPH! because there is nothing nicer than feeling those very low rattling notes in your body from instruments like BIG church organs etc... Sublime...ahhhh! - Neighbours? Who?


SO: Suggestions for a good musical sub to compliment my system....???

Keith

[Redwingnine]

Hard to SVS subs for the Money. They are as good or better than the majority of audiophile subs available.

[Pim]

I bought a pair of Triad In Room Platinum Subs (18") and absolutely love them.

The only comparison I can make is with my mate's JL Audio E110s, which I helped set up. It's not a great comparison, because they're a different size sub in different size room, but one thing I can say; the triads in my room sound much better than the JLs in my mate's room. I'm not saying the Triads are better because there's a lot more going on than just the subs, but they're definitely not worse.

On top of that, you don't have to have them in gloss black (my least favourite colour). You can have them in just about any colour you want. And they have separate amplifiers, so down the track when your amp dies, you're not looking to replace the lot again.

[devianet]

With -3db at 35Hz you're missing the impact of the entire bottom octave of the pipe organ (the 32ft register, which runs from 16Hz to 32Hz). You're only hearing the harmonics of this register, which begin at 32Hz.

IMO, you need a sub which is - preferably - flat to 16Hz to completely remedy this, but that can be quite a tall order especially at realistic volumes. -6db at 16Hz will still be pretty good.

I have an old REL sub which is pretty capable in this register, but I'm not currently using it for 2-channel as SAM can get a perfectly clean and time-aligned 16Hz out of the Magico A5. The effect and impact in the room is astonishing.

Your speakers appear to be SAMd, at a claimed 19Hz. Why not give it a try?

[ray1234]

With -3db at 35Hz you're missing the impact of the entire bottom octave of the pipe organ (the 32ft register, which runs from 16Hz to 32Hz). You're only hearing the harmonics of this register, which begin at 32Hz.

IMO, you need a sub which is - preferably - flat to 16Hz to completely remedy this, but that can be quite a tall order especially at realistic volumes. -6db at 16Hz will still be pretty good.

I have an old REL sub which is pretty capable in this register, but I'm not currently using it for 2-channel as SAM can get a perfectly clean and time-aligned 16Hz out of the Magico A5. The effect and impact in the room is astonishing.

Your speakers appear to be SAMd, at a claimed 19Hz. Why not give it a try?

You are not believing in Devialet's claim that after SAM your A5 can go 16hz flat out, right? Devialet also says after SAM my Kanta 2 can go 20hz, I can tell you no way you can hear any 20hz wave from my Kanta 2.

It may go 16hz, but -10db maybe ..... even if your main speakers can output 20hz -3db, your speaker position may not allow you to hear 20hz, as one will obviously position main speakers for soundstage and imaging, and not just for the bass. A subwoofer can always improve the bass department in a sound system, because you can place subwoofer at a place where the bass is best for your room, away from the main speakers. Because of different wave lengths of mid/highs and bass frequencies, the best positions for those is always different within a specific room, taking into account the room modes cancellation for the different frequencies.

The thing about subwoofer a lot of people has said but little people pay attention to is that they tend to improve not just the bass, but also the space perception of the soundstage and also vocals. On a properly set up subwoofer, the soundstage atmosphere and vocal expression is all better. On my system, the subwoofer is useful in those areas more than they are useful for just the bass extension.

On which subwoofer to use, I highly recommend Rythmik. I think with the servo control, it produces one of the fastest bass possible. Compared to REL, I think they are similar in quality, but Rythmik has a lot more settings like phase angles, one can place Rythmik subwoofers in a sub-optimal position and adjust those settings to allow the Rythmik to sound reasonable. REL is of the old school where you should be able to position your subwoofer anywhere you like to get the best sound, so there is not much adjustment knobs on REL. With restrictions on where you can place the subwoofer, I think Rythmik can sound better than REL.

[devianet]

My words were - "Why not give it a try?"

It (SAM) is a free option, not a lifetime commitment. If it doesn't work acceptably, then it has created no additional cost, and other alternatives (physical subwoofers) can be explored.

One shouldn't extrapolate from a SAM trial sample size of 1 that it will be the same disappointment for everybody else, especially when there are so many variables affecting bass in different listening rooms, not least the speakers themselves.

I have already presented a counterexample - my SAM'd A5s are good enough and effective enough that they displace a 90kg subwoofer which, when properly positioned and adjusted, can achieve -6db at 9Hz. They are not a poor alternative to the subwoofer - they are better than it in every way, and they even do that "general space and ambience + greater mid+treble clarity" thing which is generally supposed to be a subwoofer effect but actually is more of a properly-extended-bass thing. This can be heard by toggling SAM on and off via the remote - it is "night and day".

So there is a least a chance that SAM may be very helpful to the OP. And it costs them nothing to try it. So why would they not?

[Jean-Marie]

I fully agree with @devianet , depending on the speakers, SAM can really do wonders.

When I hear what it is capable of with just the 7’’ of my speakers, I have no doubt that it can deliver 20Hz or lower width the 3x9’’ of the A5 given that it has the full power of a D1000 to deliver it.

I would even submit that given the close load design of the Magicos, most woofer which are bass reflex would have a really hard time to deliver bass as cleanly as the D1000 + SAM + A5 can.

And the ice on the cake is that as said, it doesn’t cost a penny to try.

Jean-Marie