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+--- Thread: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note (/Thread-Firmware-13-2-0-DOS-2-2-6-for-Expert-Pro-Release-note)
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - alandbush - 11-Oct-2020
(11-Oct-2020, 17:56)Stino Wrote: Hello friends,
Just experimented with the Room Perfect feature. However, unsure whether I am doing it correctly.
I've done three sweeps, both channels together, and smoothed the curves. This gives me the following:
https://flic.kr/p/2jSivRP
Is that a reasonable starting point. Subsequently, I did as given in https://pbxbook.com/other/devialeteq.html but I did not get the link 'calculate target level from response'. So tried some clicks here and there and suddently got a file:
"EQ_1_L":[36.0, -12.0, 7.100],
"EQ_2_L":[4980, -5.3, 1.400],
"EQ_3_L":[205, -7.7, 2.500],
"EQ_4_L":[337, -1.8, 1.100],
"EQ_5_L":[499, -4.9, 4.500],
"EQ_6_L":[1110, -7.1, 7.900],
"EQ_7_L":[138, -7.6, 10.000],
"EQ_8_L":[91.6, -6.7, 10.000],
To me, these frequencies are not really the bumps / drops on the graph, right, and no clue whether the other values make sense. The music does sound a bit dull and have the feeling I lost quite some details. Can someone help me out here?
Thanks!
PS: also have the feeling i need to turn the volume up more than before...
Could you attach the REW specific measurement file, I.e. with a file type of .mdat
I hope you saved one!
Anyone can then load your measurement file and check your results.
I write this because filters 3 and 4 don't appear to match your supplied screenshot.
Ps - have you taken any measurements after applying the EQ?
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - Dev_Steve - 12-Oct-2020
(11-Oct-2020, 21:56)alandbush Wrote:I have had the same problem. I followed the instructions provided on the PBX Cookbook site, got the measurements from REW, and the result is the new EQ settings completely stripped out the bottom end. It's almost like all of the bass has been cut. I have a sub running on my system and that was on when I took the measurements. Don't know if that has anything to do with it. I was really surprised at how much the sound got stripped down after running this. Anyone else have this issue?(11-Oct-2020, 17:56)Stino Wrote: Hello friends,
Just experimented with the Room Perfect feature. However, unsure whether I am doing it correctly.
I've done three sweeps, both channels together, and smoothed the curves. This gives me the following:
https://flic.kr/p/2jSivRP
Is that a reasonable starting point. Subsequently, I did as given in https://pbxbook.com/other/devialeteq.html but I did not get the link 'calculate target level from response'. So tried some clicks here and there and suddently got a file:
"EQ_1_L":[36.0, -12.0, 7.100],
"EQ_2_L":[4980, -5.3, 1.400],
"EQ_3_L":[205, -7.7, 2.500],
"EQ_4_L":[337, -1.8, 1.100],
"EQ_5_L":[499, -4.9, 4.500],
"EQ_6_L":[1110, -7.1, 7.900],
"EQ_7_L":[138, -7.6, 10.000],
"EQ_8_L":[91.6, -6.7, 10.000],
To me, these frequencies are not really the bumps / drops on the graph, right, and no clue whether the other values make sense. The music does sound a bit dull and have the feeling I lost quite some details. Can someone help me out here?
Thanks!
PS: also have the feeling i need to turn the volume up more than before...
Could you attach the REW specific measurement file, I.e. with a file type of .mdat
I hope you saved one!
Anyone can then load your measurement file and check your results.
I write this because filters 3 and 4 don't appear to match your supplied screenshot.
Ps - have you taken any measurements after applying the EQ?
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - Bartype - 12-Oct-2020
(11-Oct-2020, 21:56)alandbush Wrote:(11-Oct-2020, 17:56)Stino Wrote: Hello friends,
Just experimented with the Room Perfect feature. However, unsure whether I am doing it correctly.
I've done three sweeps, both channels together, and smoothed the curves. This gives me the following:
https://flic.kr/p/2jSivRP
Is that a reasonable starting point. Subsequently, I did as given in https://pbxbook.com/other/devialeteq.html but I did not get the link 'calculate target level from response'. So tried some clicks here and there and suddently got a file:
"EQ_1_L":[36.0, -12.0, 7.100],
"EQ_2_L":[4980, -5.3, 1.400],
"EQ_3_L":[205, -7.7, 2.500],
"EQ_4_L":[337, -1.8, 1.100],
"EQ_5_L":[499, -4.9, 4.500],
"EQ_6_L":[1110, -7.1, 7.900],
"EQ_7_L":[138, -7.6, 10.000],
"EQ_8_L":[91.6, -6.7, 10.000],
To me, these frequencies are not really the bumps / drops on the graph, right, and no clue whether the other values make sense. The music does sound a bit dull and have the feeling I lost quite some details. Can someone help me out here?
Thanks!
PS: also have the feeling i need to turn the volume up more than before...
Could you attach the REW specific measurement file, I.e. with a file type of .mdat
I hope you saved one!
Anyone can then load your measurement file and check your results.
I write this because filters 3 and 4 don't appear to match your supplied screenshot.
Ps - have you taken any measurements after applying the EQ?
Try selecting RePhase at the Equaliser tab after you got the EQ Filters and use these Q numbers for Sweet room.
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - JFX - 12-Oct-2020
(11-Oct-2020, 17:56)Stino Wrote: Hello friends,
Just experimented with the Room Perfect feature. However, unsure whether I am doing it correctly.
I've done three sweeps, both channels together, and smoothed the curves. This gives me the following:
https://flic.kr/p/2jSivRP
Is that a reasonable starting point. Subsequently, I did as given in https://pbxbook.com/other/devialeteq.html but I did not get the link 'calculate target level from response'. So tried some clicks here and there and suddently got a file:
"EQ_1_L":[36.0, -12.0, 7.100],
"EQ_2_L":[4980, -5.3, 1.400],
"EQ_3_L":[205, -7.7, 2.500],
"EQ_4_L":[337, -1.8, 1.100],
"EQ_5_L":[499, -4.9, 4.500],
"EQ_6_L":[1110, -7.1, 7.900],
"EQ_7_L":[138, -7.6, 10.000],
"EQ_8_L":[91.6, -6.7, 10.000],
To me, these frequencies are not really the bumps / drops on the graph, right, and no clue whether the other values make sense. The music does sound a bit dull and have the feeling I lost quite some details. Can someone help me out here?
Thanks!
PS: also have the feeling i need to turn the volume up more than before...
Those settings looks quite odd, I would recommend not do so much with the frequencies above 700 hz and a good advice is if u have to pump up a frequency I would not add more that + 6 db plus those it can overload your amp. did you choice the eq DCX2496 those it shows values for a 9 band eq!
Here is some handy links for REW:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lM99RB4gt8o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1aYsjPc2m4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev1bSSL8tRA
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - Soniclife - 12-Oct-2020
(10-Oct-2020, 01:08)alandbush Wrote: Not all equalisers use the same formulae and Roon and Sweet Room are different.
For example
Roon
For the Peaking filters the bandwidth in Hz between the half gain points is given by:
Bandwidth = centre frequency/Q
100hz 6db Q=7.079
Sweet Room
For the Peaking filters the bandwidth in Hz between the half gain points is given by:
Bandwidth = sqrt(gain)*centre frequency/Q
100hz 6db Q=10
As you can see, the Q values are different in generating the same filter shape.
You can convert Roon filters to Sweet Room filters by using REW.
Within REW, select EQ tab, choose the 'Generic' equaliser for Roon, enter the filter values then change the equaliser to 'Rephase'.
Is this documented somewhere? If it's not how did you work this out?
I hadn't realised any of this when I made a correction this weekend, which sounds very good right now, but I used the DCX2496 setting, which limits to 9 filters, and it also matches the rephase Q values, so it looks like I got lucky.
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - Delija - 12-Oct-2020
With any EQ - less is more.
Fix only major room modes and that's it.
Anything more than that will lead to sound quality degradation.
Don't apply positive gain to dips / nulls.
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - alandbush - 12-Oct-2020
(12-Oct-2020, 11:11)Soniclife Wrote:(10-Oct-2020, 01:08)alandbush Wrote: Not all equalisers use the same formulae and Roon and Sweet Room are different.Is this documented somewhere? If it's not how did you work this out?
For example
Roon
For the Peaking filters the bandwidth in Hz between the half gain points is given by:
Bandwidth = centre frequency/Q
100hz 6db Q=7.079
Sweet Room
For the Peaking filters the bandwidth in Hz between the half gain points is given by:
Bandwidth = sqrt(gain)*centre frequency/Q
100hz 6db Q=10
As you can see, the Q values are different in generating the same filter shape.
You can convert Roon filters to Sweet Room filters by using REW.
Within REW, select EQ tab, choose the 'Generic' equaliser for Roon, enter the filter values then change the equaliser to 'Rephase'.
Don't panic. DCX2496 is good, it just has limitations compared to Rephase.
Hopefully, this thread will provide an explanation.
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - Soniclife - 12-Oct-2020
(12-Oct-2020, 17:07)alandbush Wrote:(12-Oct-2020, 11:11)Soniclife Wrote:(10-Oct-2020, 01:08)alandbush Wrote: Not all equalisers use the same formulae and Roon and Sweet Room are different.Is this documented somewhere? If it's not how did you work this out?
For example
Roon
For the Peaking filters the bandwidth in Hz between the half gain points is given by:
Bandwidth = centre frequency/Q
100hz 6db Q=7.079
Sweet Room
For the Peaking filters the bandwidth in Hz between the half gain points is given by:
Bandwidth = sqrt(gain)*centre frequency/Q
100hz 6db Q=10
As you can see, the Q values are different in generating the same filter shape.
You can convert Roon filters to Sweet Room filters by using REW.
Within REW, select EQ tab, choose the 'Generic' equaliser for Roon, enter the filter values then change the equaliser to 'Rephase'.
Don't panic. DCX2496 is good, it just has limitations compared to Rephase.
Hopefully, this thread will provide an explanation.
Thanks, it does. This goes in the learn something new every day category.
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - deviousalet - 13-Oct-2020
Summary: My initial experimentation with Sweet Room filters from REW yield subtle changes for the worse, so point out if I'm doing something wrong.
I had previously taken measurements for Dirac and REW, so had those ready to go.
In REW I played around with rePhase filters, changing the Target Level in .1 dB increments and seeing how REW calculated the EQ filters. I chose what looked best (correcting the biggest flaws with the smallest gain) and wrote that into a Sweet Room file (using the Alternate as a control). I measured the difference in SPL when using each and then level-matched them with a 1 dB main gain so that the comparison was more valid.
I'm surprised by how subtle the difference is, but it is noticeable and not for the better. It almost seems like the processing is degrading the sound quality but the filters aren't doing anything. What I hear is flatter, less dynamic, and farther away. Voices are a notch back on the soundstage, there's a bit less bloom to crescendos, and instruments are a little less realistic. I keep staring at my Sweet Room file trying to find a syntax error (which would mean it isn't used), but the amps show it in use and there is that small difference in sound. I expected a -5.7 dB gain with 2.73 Q to be dramatic. My Dirac filters are much more noticeable. Were my expectations wrong or have I made a technical mistake somewhere?
RE: Firmware 13.2.0 - DOS 2.2.6 for Expert Pro - Release note - Flashman - 14-Oct-2020
I worked in France for five years (2011-2015) with Groupe Michelin. I can say one thing about the French professional culture: there is an obsessive focus on engineering. For the most part, that obsession is a good thing, as it leads to empirically driven solutions and a fact-driven approach. On the other hand, the engineering obsession can also result in an inordinate focus on intricate, devilishly complex solutions. Witness, my friends, Sweet Room from "Ingénierie Acoustique de France."