Audio Science Review of Expert 200.

[ssfas]

This is an excellent point, definitively they cannot. 

Consider you are measuring a "conventional" integrated amplifier, here you can measure just the amplifier, but to get measurements directly comparable to a digitally fed Devialet, you would need to add a DAC, which presumably adds its own noise, distortion and whatever else.

Indeed, in the case of the ASR measurements, or other measurements made via the analogue input, you are inevitably adding any noise or distortions from the ADC, which most of us do not need to use.  Clearly this penalises the Devialet results if considered in direct comparison with a conventional amplifier.

I suppose you could make direct comparisons of the digital input with integrated amps like the Gryphon or Hegal, which include their own DACs, but essentially these are just amp and DAC in the same box, a little different to Devialets ADH where the DAC is integral to the amplifiers performance.

A further step beyond all this is that with the typical usage for many, the Devialet is also a source as AIR or the CI board is effectively a "networked attached end point".

I do find the measurements interesting though.  As an example, I know many Devialet users get excellent subjective results using an external phono stage, which is fair enough when you consider that the built in phono stage is audibly noisy with low output MC's.  However, seeing how the various inputs measure, an external digital phono stage with S/PDIF output might be even better.  In theory at least.  It might even be possible to use a conventional analogue phono stage with an external ADC, which might yield good results if the external ADC measures better than Devialet's internal offering.  Again, in theory at least.

As an aside, I'm using the "listening with ears" method this morning.  No issues detected so far …….  

Hi Confused,

I am not really getting why the measurement of analog input is noisy. I have a turntable connected to my 1000 Pro, no matter the MM cartridge I used before or the currentC cartridge. Both is very very quite, friend came to my house listen to it are surprised Vinly can be this clean. The Devialet background is like black black black, it’s one of the thing it surprised me. So I don’t know what those measurements reflected in real world listening.

Well, the clue is Confused has referred to low output MC cartridges which many of us use and have found with appropriate settings within the configurator,  the system sounds noisy, in particular hiss. I have no doubt that any MM cartridge will sound just fine with the configurator appropriately set. Those of us with low output MC cartridges have generally reverted to the addition of external step up transformers or a separate dedicated MC phono stage, as I have done. This issue has been communicated to Devialet and Matthew Pernot has personally looked at the problem and has concluded that the level of noise is acceptable. That is nonsense because users are troubled by the noise. As said, (considering the refusal to accept there is a noise issue) most of us in this situation have found our own solutions. I don’t blame Devialet for this because I realise how hard it is to create a noise free low output MC stage particularly when the amp has everything crammed into such a small space when low output MC cartridges benefit from expanded low noise construction requiring components in the phono amplifier section to be well spaced........not possible in a Devialet chassis. 

So, a separate MC phono amplifier absolutely works for me. My two gripes are 1, why can’t Devialet publicly recognise the problem and either acknowledge that they can’t fix it or better, do something that does fix it. My 2nd is I’m a bit pissed that I have to accommodate the space of a separate MC phono stage when one of my main drivers for going full Devialet was that I would have a simple one box system. Unfortunately, it seems that’s not going to happen. Otherwise, the sound of my 250 Pro C/I is magnificent!

I also have a 250 Pro CI and was using an Urushi 0.2mv and a high output MM 2m Mono. I did not find the Urushi dead quiet, but still very good and perfectly satisfactory for 3 years. I am now using it with an external phono, the Vertere Mk2 unit, it's excellent and very cheap. 

I now have a high output (2.3mv I think) SoundSmith Zephyr Mk3. This is a moving iron unit with a very light cantilever. It's extremely impressive and dead quiet direct into the Devialet.

A chap I know has after many years gone to an external Brinkmann phono amp on a 220 Pro (formerly a 200).