How much amplifier power do you really need?

[RebelMan]

I'm sorry but it is a complicated question. You assume that "people" believe more power will sound better so they're asking how much power they need to make things sound the best that they can sound but if people simply believed that more power sounded better everyone would be buying D1000s and no one would be buying D140s. While you may argue that the depth of our wallets is a limiting factor that too isn't universally the case. Lots of people buy smaller amps than they could afford to buy. You've got a straw man argument going on.

It's only complicated for people working with unknowns.   When you have the answers to the unknowns the question (How much power do I need?) becomes quite clear.  So what's the problem?  Where people are getting their answers from... the sales guy (and misinformed users).

I have the funds to purchase the D1000 but I don't need it, unlike the O d'A, which I also do not need, but find so beautifully irresistible.  In fact, I replaced a whole mountain of gear that totaled more than $25K USD with a diminutive D120 (D140) which produced 400 watts less so I am living proof that less is more.

The problem is people believe more power will sound better because some joker says it will and they have no reason to question that.  After all, they are in the "business" or they are the listening "experts", so they take their advice on face value, aka faith.  And for the record, I am not assuming anything.  Look around here and you'll see plenty of comments supporting the "belief".

The reason the question is going on is because of the factors involved, factors such as preferred listening and peak listening levels, speaker sensitivity, listening distance, room size and setup of the speakers and listening position in the room, room construction and furnishings, openings to other spaces and the characteristics of the other spaces. All of those things affect the level of sound we hear in the room for a given amount of power and none of them have anything to do with a belief that more power sounds better.

Totally agree.  I never once said that people don't need more power.  I have only said that more power does not imply better sound quality.  If it is determined that someone needs a D1000 because a D140 distorts or goes into clipping or the protection circuits trigger frequently then by all means use the bigger amp.  On the other hand, if a D140 can satisfy every criteria the listener needs using a D1000 in place of that WILL NOT make the system sound better.  That's the point.

In an earlier post above you said  "…more power does not sound better than less power all else being equal."  I agree, all else being equal an amp with more power will not sound better than an amp with less power when both are producing the same SPL at the listening position but how often is all else equal? If you have a situation where an amp with more power sounds better than an amp with less power when both are producing the same SPL at the listening position then obviously all else is not equal. If you want to claim that an amp with more power can't sound better than a smaller amp which is also capable of producing the same level then you need to show that all else is equal and you haven't attempted to do that. I would respectfully suggest to you that when you compare amps with different power outputs, even amps from within the same range such as the 140/220/250 you will find differences apart from the power output so all else is not equal. That being the case I have to say that, at the very least, a difference in sound quality is possible.

What do I mean by all else being equal?... well... by all else being equal!  Joking aside, lets assume the only two differences in a given room and system were the D140 and the D1000.  If the D140 was pushed beyond it's capabilities, lets say to an SPL of about 102dB (my setup) then the extra headroom (8.54dB) provided by the D1000 could make it sound better than the D140 but only because the D140 is underperforming, not because the D1000 is not underperforming.

Power, in and of itself, does not determine sound quality.  It's the engineering that goes into making power that determines sound quality.  Architecturally speaking, the Expert Pros are identical and so they should sound the same for a given SPL that does not breach the capabilities the weakest amplifier, the D140 in this case.  I say "should sound" because people have varying opinions about what they hear.  But what they hear has no baring on what is, the Expert Pros are in fact the same.

Any differences that exists between the models (besides the additional power) has to do with how efficient each model tackles the additonal heat that is generated.  The D1000 can produce more heat than the others and therefore steps were taken to make it dissipate heat better allowing it to be a true dual-mono design.  The other models like the 440 and 210 are "dual-mono" in nomenclature only and are not true dual-mono capable.  If they were then the power output of each would QUADRUPLE, not be limited to double more power you get with the D440 and only one and a half times more power you get with the D210. But let me be clear, the D440 and the D210 are true dual-mono designs but Devialet limits their capability because of the additional costs it would incur to deal with the additional heat.  This in turn helps lower per unit costs making it possible for Devialet to sell to a larger audience.  Remember, this is a business... first, and power is expensive but sound quality needn't be.  Want proof?  The DAC shootout I briefly mentioned in another post was very telling.  The cheapest DAC won!