A touch of brightness

[technikspezi]

I had some similar problems and rotation the plug of the power cord by 180° solved the problem. The slightly sharp "ss" has gone. (D200).
Give it a try

If you have more than one device connected by electrical wire, you have to set all devices to correct phase at the power cord.

[Womaz]

I had some similar problems and rotation the plug of the power cord by 180° solved the problem. The slightly sharp "ss" has gone. (D200).
Give it a try

If you have more than one device connected by electrical wire, you have to set all devices to correct phase at the power cord.

Sorry I dont understand what you mean, can you clarify please?

[completeluxury]

he might live somewhere that its normal to rewire plugs.

you are from the UK - your sockets/plugs wont have the problem he is describing the solution for

[Womaz]

he might live somewhere that its normal to rewire plugs.

you are from the UK - your sockets/plugs wont have the problem he is describing the solution for

Thanks for clarification

[technikspezi]

Yes, he's right. In the UK it's not possible to rotate the power plug. So this problem/solution does not matter to you.

[Womaz]

Ok the panels arrived yesterday so here are my first impressions.

Do they make a difference? Absolutely. I am amazed at how four panels can totally change the sound and dynamics of my room. It's so different

So all good?? Well I am not so sure yet. The brightness has definitely been tamed, by quite a bit too. So that is what the aim was. Music seems more rounded and softer, but my first impressions are I miss the attack and punch of my untreated room. Definitely sounds a little duller. So I will see how I feel after a few more days. Dull may be a tad harsh word to use.

Volume has to go up about three notches too, but that's not really a problem.

As an experiment I put the panels up and played the same track five times and then took them down and played it again. The brightness was very evident straight away.

The tracks I struggled with before all sound better and much less bright.

Starting to think that this is all like a trade off .......get rid of something but have to forego something else.

Biggest downside for me is that they are pretty ugly and I am not sure I will be able to get used to them. Daughter comes tomorrow she's going to hate them

[Damon]

Womaz,

Actually, I'd say this is a very good result. It strongly suggests that the system is not too 'bright' or 'treble forward'. That relieves you of the need to look to more expensive experimentation with the various bits of hardware.... at least, I hope it does! If the acoustic panels make a clear difference in brightness, I'd also guess that you have eliminated a lot of out-of-phase sound as well. All the bouncing around of the high frequencies would give you some smearing of the sound, whereas now you are very likely getting a cleaner, more correct picture of the music. So, perhaps you have lost only the sound that is not supposed to be there....

Alas, the aesthetic factor is one that is hard to resolve to your satisfaction, as well as that of others. I suspect very few acoustically still rooms would make the cover of an interior decorating glossy.

But very interesting that the difference is apparent and repeatable with the placement of the panels. Thanks for this report.

[Antoine]

Without measurements we can't be sure what's changed and how/how much and whether it's enough. But in any case I think your brain has to "decompensate" after getting used to a certain type of sound for years, so I'd give it some time. Also you may have to do/re-do some fine tuning of your system like loudspeaker placement/amount of toe-in etc. There's no doubt in my mind you're now hearing more of the intended sound and less of the room induced sound.

Now that you have effective panels you could also start experimenting with their locations, perhaps not for definitive placement or for these exact panels but at least to learn how they can work out/influence the sound in these different locations. It could as well be that these thick panels provide too much absorption in this location so close to your ears and tilt the balance to the unnatural. I don't think they're too much for your room it may just be their location. (to give you an idea I know I have near to 40m^2 of absorbing panels (Rockfon Sonar D acoustic tiles) in my room, all on the ceiling and a very heavy 2,5x2m wool rug on the floor in my seating position but reverberation times are still a little bit too high (shown in measurements), there's also still some flutter echo between my parallel walls)

[Hifi_swlon]

Great news that you're getting somewhere with the panels Womaz….

I'm new to this measurement lark as you know, but having read so many posts over the years of people saying 'just measure your room, then at least you know what you're dealing with', I'll jump in and second that (having ignored this advice for years) its a great idea to measure!

I bought a UMIK-1 from Keith @Purite Audio (also a pfm member), for £75.  I borrowed a mic stand from a friend, but its not essential it just makes it easier, especially for multiple position measurement.  I then also needed a USB extension cable to make it practical, at £5.

As you know, I'm trialling Dirac, but if you just want to measure, there are free options - some with a lot more features than Dirac in the measuring dept, like R.E.W.  

Its been an eye opener for me.  The first thing it showed is that I was using absolutely the wrong frequencies in my experiments with the Devialet EQ.  Thats the problem with trial and error and guessing.  In all my EQ tests I was adding more bass right at the point where there was already too much.  The 'thinness' came because bass above and below that frequency were reduced, while bass around the 50-100Hz had a big spike.

The beauty of Dirac, even if you only ever use the trial to experiment, is that you can tweak the desired output curve of your speakers, without really having to get too technical or worry about how it does it.  You can also have up to 4 filters at a time to select from at the click of a button, so you can quickly see the differences. It also means that you can have filters more suited to 'bright' recordings and use them when appropriate, or just an EQ that takes your fancy for one track, or whatever….

In your current case, you'd be able to measure before and after with the panels, and see the results - perhaps there will now be too much frequency reduction in certain areas, or not enough in others, and it would give you a better understanding.

I know some people are anti-room EQ, and that it doesn't suit all situations, and of course means you need a computer in the chain or a dedicated box running, but its really opened my eyes.  I really love the sound form my system at the moment, and I'm a total beginner with it, and even did the measurements a bit 'wrong' .  But the sound I'm getting is what I've wanted it to sound like for ages.  When I toggle the filters off, in some cases the sound is so thin and bass-shy that I wonder how I put up with it for so long without taking action.  Of course I didn't, I haven't been happy or excited about my stereo setup for ages (since I moved house), no matter what kit I've used.  Now I can relax.  I could now live with my Neats, and I'm hopeful for the PMCs or any future speaker.  

I feel like a Room Correction evangelist this week, but its been a real eye opener for me, and I'm so happy with it!

In an ideal world I'd treat with panels etc as well, to reduce the overhead on the EQ, and also to have it more generically dealt with in the room, but as you know the panels just aren't going to work in my lounge so I don't have that option.  What I've ended up with via Dirac is a sound I'm really happy with. I can now tinker to my hearts content, or set and forget, so I'm happy (or I will be when they release an OSX fix).

I can foresee problems in the future - the upcoming RoonSpeakers won't work as anticipated with Dirac in the chain as it is now, so thats possibly going to be annoying. Also, if you want to move your speakers or bump them, technically it should be re-measured and new filters made, but that's probably quite extreme.  You know, there are always pro and cons, but for me personally, I feel like I've found hifi peace.

I might be back-tracking after I try with the Facts at the weekend, but I really hope not.  It just seems to work so well now I'd be surprised if it didnt with 'better' speakers.  But we'll see. Wherever I end up, I know I'll never guess whats going on if I have these issues in the future.  I'll definitely measure, and hopefully save myself a fortune kit-swapping….

Back to your room, I'm not sure if it does the same as your panels, but I did see a quite nice design when I was considering them, and I've seen them look quite nice in a few dealers listening rooms I've been in - the nicer looking ones that have a bit more of a 'modern home lounge' kind of feel - and they didnt look out of place. Dont know the brand, but they feature in the video of the Original d'Atelier that was posted on this site here: http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2015/1...-datelier/

Maybe they'd keep your daughter happy if you want to keep panels up?  

Keep us updated…..

[Hifi_swlon]

….(to give you an idea I know I have near to 40m^2 of absorbing panels (Rockfon Sonar D acoustic tiles) in my room, all on the ceiling and a very heavy 2,5x2m wool rug on the floor ...

Wow, thats an impressive amount of panels!