Audio Science Review of Expert 200.

[PeppaPig]

"Yikes, ASR's biases not withstanding that peak power figure at 20khz is a surprise."

Not sure how much money ASR expect to receive from Devialet to has their next positive review, lol. ASR is among the worse money hungry reviewer.

[whatmore]

"Yikes, ASR's biases not withstanding that peak power figure at 20khz is a surprise."

Not sure how much money ASR expect to receive from Devialet to has their next positive review, lol. ASR is among the worse money hungry reviewer.

There is almost certainly zero evidence for that assertion.
It's also irrelevant to the actual measurements - unless you are suggesting that ASR are making those up?

[petrik]

The ASR review has DPM turned on

That is quite possible.

I can't remember where, but i have twice read about Devialet's poor measurements in past, due to SAM being on as found later on. And the measurements were done by well-known reviewers. I've ignored any measurements presented in "audio media" since then.

Yep. For example Stereophile and Stereoplay both have published not so optimal measurement results of the Devialet Expert.

I would really like to see some measurements that would prove that Devialet's official figures like signal-to-noise ratio 130dB and distortion 0,0005% are really true. Or are these numbers just marketing? I hope that's not the case.

[markush]

Yes that would be important to verify to quit this rumor and customers gain trust/confidence.

[Pim]

The ASR review has DPM turned on

That is quite possible.

I can't remember where, but i have twice read about Devialet's poor measurements in past, due to SAM being on as found later on. And the measurements were done by well-known reviewers. I've ignored any measurements presented in "audio media" since then.

Yep. For example Stereophile and Stereoplay both have published not so optimal measurement results of the Devialet Expert.

I would really like to see some measurements that would prove that Devialet's official figures like signal-to-noise ratio 130dB and distortion 0,0005% are really true. Or are these numbers just marketing? I hope that's not the case.

If your ears can't tell you, does it really matter? Many people buy valve amps, knowing fully well that they give a somewhat distorted euphonic sound. But they buy them because they like that sound. The 'marketing' never was part of my buying decision.

[PeppaPig]

"Yikes, ASR's biases not withstanding that peak power figure at 20khz is a surprise."

Not sure how much money ASR expect to receive from Devialet to has their next positive review, lol. ASR is among the worse money hungry reviewer.

There is almost certainly zero evidence for that assertion.
It's also irrelevant to the actual measurements - unless you are suggesting that ASR are making those up?

Yep, I question his intention reviewing a discontinued model. He is looking for Devialet to give him some money so he can publish positive review with the "repaired" unit.

Its apparently a set up. Why he didn't test a Expert PRO brand new unit from Devialet?

WHAT is the value for him to test a discontinue unit? for second hand buyer ?? lol, don't try to joke mate. This guy is a rubbish, I know his game. He won't get a $1 from Devialet.

[petrik]

That is quite possible.

I can't remember where, but i have twice read about Devialet's poor measurements in past, due to SAM being on as found later on. And the measurements were done by well-known reviewers. I've ignored any measurements presented in "audio media" since then.

Yep. For example Stereophile and Stereoplay both have published not so optimal measurement results of the Devialet Expert.

I would really like to see some measurements that would prove that Devialet's official figures like signal-to-noise ratio 130dB and distortion 0,0005% are really true. Or are these numbers just marketing? I hope that's not the case.

If your ears can't tell you, does it really matter? Many people buy valve amps, knowing fully well that they give a somewhat distorted euphonic sound. But they buy them because they like that sound. The 'marketing' never was part of my buying decision.

I see Devialet as an engineering company that makes sure that their products measure well. Many of their published materials, like web page and white papers, regarding the D-Premier, Expert, and Expert Pro is based on great measured performance. This gives an impression that the measurements are very important for them and that they do take a good care of excellent measured performance before releasing new products / upgrades. We also saw great measured performance on the D-Premier, I think those measurements were done by Stereophile on 2010.

If their products do not measure fine in reality, at least I would be really disappointed.

That said, the Devialet Expert can be hard to measure since it has many unique features (variable input sensitivity, DPM, SAM, ICM, etc). I can totally understand that it's very hard for a reviewer to know what settings to use when taking measurements. Many of these settings do affect to the measured performance.

[whatmore]

Yep, I question his intention reviewing a discontinued model. He is looking for Devialet to give him some money so he can publish positive review with the "repaired" unit.

Do you have any evidence for this claim?

Its apparently a set up. Why he didn't test a Expert PRO brand new unit from Devialet?

Why should he, are you saying the Expert range is rubbish and shouldn't be tested?

WHAT is the value for him to test a discontinue unit? for second hand buyer ?? lol, don't try to joke mate. This guy is a rubbish, I know his game. He won't get a $1 from Devialet.

I'm pretty sure he wants no money from Devialet, that assertion is only coming from you and is completely without any evidence

[Antoine]

While I don’t particularly like ASR’s “reviews”, especially the comments in between the measurements and their conclusions I think it’s a bit far fetched (to put it mildly) to view this as a preconceived set up.

Both the previous and current owners have made themselves known. Also ASR measures a lot of different stuff so why would they specifically target Devialet. They succeeded in making some measurements before the unit stopped working so it wasn’t broken beforehand (or at least not completely). In any case it would be a risky move, most likely it would fail.

[Confused]

Mindful of some of the posts above, it has already been noted that the Devialet Expert has been tested by a number of other entities.

Looking at the measurements by Paul Miller (post #44) it is interesting that the S/N ratio measurements he made are fairly similar to those in the ASR review, for the analogue input at least.

That is, Signal-to-Noise Ratio (A-weighted, 6th-Octave mode) into 8ohm = 93dB for the analogue input. A key point to note is that per Miller's various reports the digital input measures much better at 118dB. OK - there is nothing here that matches the 130dB that Devialet claim, but then again, there are no details as to the basis of Devialet's figure. I have to say that 130dB does look a little optimistic, but that said, 118dB is excellent. In terms of ASR's SINAD scale, the Expert tested would have looked much better if the digital input used, up there with the very best. Even via the analogue input the results are pretty decent, by any normal standards.

In summary, if you want to know how well a Devialet Expert measures, I think most of what you might want to know is already covered in the tests my Paul Miller and others. For example, the Miller measurements show THD figures for a whole range of frequency ranges and power levels, many of these are in line with Devialet's quoted figures, some are not.

The point is, if you want to know how a D170 measures, there is plenty of published data available already, and most of it looks pretty decent.

None of this solves the low watts / high frequency test tone conundrum, or the curious phase shift plot in the ASR review. I think these issues could do with a response from Devialet. Time will tell …..

As for ASR conspiracy theories, I think ASR tend to review whatever they can get their hands on. A lot of the tests are made on items loaned for testing by other forum members, which seams to be the case with the D200. I am sure if they were given a brand new Pro, they would happily test it. OK - They enjoy finding a bad measurement and having as much fun as possible out of it, but I see no foul play here.