Firmware 8.1 released!

[Mikeeo]

I have measured my speakers room response with SAM V1 and V2. With V1 there was an extreme bass boost like a low shelf filter starting around 100 Hz. With SAM at 100% I had about 10db level increase at 20 Hz. With SAM V2 the low shelf starts at 50hz, the level increase at 20Hz is only 3db. So there is a big difference between both versions, at least for the Giya G2 profile.
Most recordings do not really contain such low frequencies, so in most cases there is no hearable bass boost. My speakers go down to 20Hz anyway (the room helps a bit).
If the phase correction of SAM would result in general better SQ I would still keep SAM with 0% or maybe 20%, but as soon as I activate SAM the higher frequencies get more agressive and less natural. So currently SAM is not an option for me. It seems as if the processing does have a negative impact. Not sure if SAM V1 had the same impact, but here this was maybe hidden by the stronger bass response.

Thanks for this input! I will try to reduce my setting from 30% to less or even 0 but also test without SAM.

/Mike

[Confused]

In general 8.1 is better in both SQ and usability in terms of setting options. However now I have bottom out bass at some material which I almost managed to cure with the correct phase setting.
Still it occurs though so anyone else with the same experience to which I think is valid only for smaller speakers!? Does SAM V2 allow deeper bass or higher volume in the low freq area? To me I do not feel more bass or louder low freq than before only bottom out at some material, software flaw?

Mike

I'm not sure if I understand what you are trying to describe by "bottom out bass"?  Are you saying that the Devialet is holding back the bass at higher volumes?

[Confused]

I have measured my speakers room response with SAM V1 and V2. With V1 there was an extreme bass boost like a low shelf filter starting around 100 Hz. With SAM at 100% I had about 10db level increase at 20 Hz. With SAM V2 the low shelf starts at 50hz, the level increase at 20Hz is only 3db. So there is a big difference between both versions, at least for the Giya G2 profile.
Most recordings do not really contain such low frequencies, so in most cases there is no hearable bass boost. My speakers go down to 20Hz anyway (the room helps a bit).
If the phase correction of SAM would result in general better SQ I would still keep SAM with 0% or maybe 20%, but as soon as I activate SAM the higher frequencies get more agressive and less natural. So currently SAM is not an option for me. It seems as if the processing does have a negative impact. Not sure if SAM V1 had the same impact, but here this was maybe hidden by the stronger bass response.

This is very interesting indeed!  I am a fan of SAM, but I do think that there is sometimes too much of a bass boost at the very lowest frequencies.  This is great fun with the odd electronic music track, but a lot of the time it's just exaggerating low frequency grunge that exists in the recording.  I have been resisting the urge to try 8.1, I've simply been enjoying the music too much with 7.1.3 to be bothered.  Reading this has made me too curious to resist much longer!

[Vivialet]

Hi Confused,
before you change your configuration please try to set SAM to 0% and check the difference between SAM on and off. Is SAM still an improvement or maybe not ? It will still be fuller sounding (at least for me) but what happens to higher frequencies ?

[Confused]

Hi Confused,
before you change your configuration please try to set SAM to 0% and check the difference between SAM on and off. Is SAM still an improvement or maybe not ? It will still be fuller sounding (at least for me) but what happens to higher frequencies ?

I must admit I have been fairly stubbornly sticking to SAM 100%.  My normal modus operandi is to A B test things very thoroughly and once I've decided on something, I will then stop tweaking and just enjoy the system.  (Or just enjoy the music, to use the cliché)

However, I can feel a bit of serious 7.1.3 vs 8.1 testing coming on, and should have time for this at the weekend.  Mindful that SAM implementation is different in 8.1, I think experimenting with SAM % is a good idea.  I'll include this in the mix at the weekend, your comments on high frequencies noted.  It should be interesting!  (Although too much experimenting and A B testing does send me slightly bonkers after a while)

[Mikeeo]

In general 8.1 is better in both SQ and usability in terms of setting options. However now I have bottom out bass at some material which I almost managed to cure with the correct phase setting.
Still it occurs though so anyone else with the same experience to which I think is valid only for smaller speakers!? Does SAM V2 allow deeper bass or higher volume in the low freq area? To me I do not feel more bass or louder low freq than before only bottom out at some material, software flaw?

Mike

I'm not sure if I understand what you are trying to describe by "bottom out bass"?  Are you saying that the Devialet is holding back the bass at higher volumes?

OK, the loudspeakers goes outside their limit, clips or something and then SAM goes in and regulates by temporary lowering the volume. Typical behavior when a loudspeaker can't handle the power or reproduce the signal it is asked for.

/M

[Confused]

Thanks Mike, now I know exactly what you mean. I have noticed this with 7.1.1, but only at crazy volumes, but this was in no way an issue in normal use. I'll be annoyed if this is more apparent with 8.1, time will tell once I give 8.1 a try.

[Rufus McDufus]

I've been experimenting with SAM settings over the last week or two, after realising that the slightly excessive bass really isn't helping in a small room with rather poorly sited speakers. I've found myself gradually reduce it and it's been set to 20% for the last week and I've been really enjoying music though it's sounding a little thin. My issue though is that surely SAM is sub-optimal at anything less than 100% - or is it? I really don't fully understand what it's supposed to be doing apart from the volume-dependent phase correction sub 150-200kHz or so. Is there an artificial bass boost going on at higher SAM percentages? Does the percentage setting merely vary the volume threshold between full SAM and no SAM?

[Confused]

I was told by Devialet's chief engineer that the phase correction effects of SAM work irrespective of SAM %, assuming SAM in on. The "bass boost" is simply trying to correct the bass roll off or any unevenness in the bass curve. Of course, room interaction will also tend to cause bass humps and dips, so the end result will be very dependent on room, speakers, positioning etc. I'm now very intrigued by the information provided by Oxford Audio "Dynamic compression is now based upon signal as opposed to volume. You should find deep bass at high levels". This appears to be a little at odds with what Mikeso posted earlier. Or is it? Maybe SAM V2 is imposing dynamic compression at lower volumes? I'm just hoping now that when I try V8.1 everything just sounds good and I can stop worrying too much!

[Rufus McDufus]

Seeing as there can't be too many variables in play here, perhaps the SAM percentage is just the level of bass boost? I thought it was the level of phase correction but have seen it mentioned on here a few times that even SAM at 0% is correcting phase. Would be nice to know exactly what it's doing. I'm not keen on the idea of any excessive bass boosting and to my ears it's always sounded like that's an element of it!
[sorry I'm going a bit off topic here]