Moon Mind 180 - Questions about control points/server software

[Ants]

Having just purchased a Devialet 120, I am using a dedicated Mac Mini connected via USB and use the Apple remote app on an iPad to control the library. However, having come from a UPnP environment, I really do like the convenience of not having a computer in the mix and I am not a fan of the remote app as it has many limitations.

With this said, I have an opportunity to purchase a s/h Moon Mind 180, which would allow me to eliminate the computer and use a control point.

My question(s) are the following for those of you using the Moon Mind 180:
- what control points/IOS apps have you been able to use other than the Moon Mind HD app.
- does the Moon app play nice with Minimserver server, which resides on my NAS
- how good/bad are the Moon Mind HD app compared to Linn or Naim's apps
- are there other scenarios, control points, server software that I have not considered by adding the Moon Mind 180 to the mix

I intend to connect to streamer/renderer via digital coaxial to the Devialet.

Appreciate the help

Cheers
Ants

[Rufus McDufus]

I personally didn't like the Moon MiND HD app at all! It seemed to have some critical bugs for me that others didn't seem to experience. It crashed frequently and the iPad's memory 'reaper' just seemed to kill it all the time when backgrounded, even when if the only other app running was a web browser with just 1 or 2 tabs (a single Safari tab consumes typically several hundred MB amount of memory scarily, but there was ample memory free). I ended up using Linn's Kinsky and using BubbleUPNP Server on my Qnap NAS to operate as a proxy providing Openhome functionality. It worked pretty well though a few features were missing - predominantly seek (skip forward/back) and pause didn't pause but stopped the track. It wasn't ideal and Kinsky isn't the most exciting thing in the world despite me being well used to it. Linn's Kazoo is getting a lot better now and you could also use the Lumin app which is much prettier.

The sound made up for it and it's a really nice musical player. Not super-detailed though. Probably the opposite to the Aries in my opinion!

[Ants]

I personally didn't like the Moon MiND HD app at all! It seemed to have some critical bugs for me that others didn't seem to experience.  It crashed frequently and the iPad's memory 'reaper' just seemed to kill it all the time when backgrounded, even when if the only other app running was a web browser with just 1 or 2 tabs (a single Safari tab consumes typically several hundred MB amount of memory scarily, but there was ample memory free). I ended up using Linn's Kinsky and using BubbleUPNP Server on my Qnap NAS to operate as a proxy providing Openhome functionality. It worked pretty well though a few features were missing - predominantly seek (skip forward/back) and pause didn't pause but stopped the track. It wasn't ideal and Kinsky isn't the most exciting thing in the world despite me being well used to it. Linn's Kazoo is getting a lot better now and you could also use the Lumin app which is much prettier.

The sound made up for it and it's a really nice musical player. Not super-detailed though. Probably the opposite to the Aries in my opinion!

I actually found and installed the BubbleUPnP .qpkg on the NAS but have yet to run it. Still sorting out how to use the Openhome functionality you refer to but it seems that this will allow me to try out a variety of control points should I opt to purchase the Moon Mind. I did not mind Kinksy when I had a Akurate DS about 4-5 years ago. Yes, the Lumin app does look like a winner. 


In regards to your last comment about being the opposite of the Aries - is the Moon that far behind in terms of details ? I am now wondering how much better can it be than my somewhat "optimized" Mac mini (SSD for OS, stripped all non essential background processes and apps, audio only server). The Mac mini/Devialet combo actually sounds great for a sub $500 source.

[Rufus McDufus]

It's not really lacking in detail. Players like the Aries seem to be able to extract a little more but I prefer the MiND personally, and I am a bit of a detail freak.

[DelaneyB]

I have just moved from a MacMini 2012 server 16GB, SSD256GB, 500GB HD optimised with Audirvana+ and USB to a 250 to a Moon Mind with AQ Coffee.
Its less 'digital' and more refined.
I'm running Twonky on the mini and the HD app. Eventual move will be to a NAS.
I've not tried any other apps yet as the HD app seems stable.

[Ants]

Thanks for the feedback and opinions, the Moon seems like a very good piece of kit. Will see if I can get my hands on the s/h unit for sale.

Also with the upcoming Montreal Audio Show a few weeks away, I will hopefully get a chance to see/touch/feel the Moon, the Aries and the entire range of high end streamers/renderers that should be present.

[jjo]

I liked MiND as a device (hardware) but didn't like the software at all.

I have to emphasize that I do not have facts, but only educated guesses on the state of the MiND control software. I have a hunch that it is not made in house but bought form a subcontractor. What has lead me to beleive this is the following... First of all, the software is not very good but it is not being actively developed either. Since 2012 there has been only 3 updates to the original software (compared to, say Auralic with 8 updates in less than a year). And the lack of updates is not due to the software being ready and awesome.

Also the MiND control software broke when the iOS was upgraded. Had there been active development, the dev team would have known this beforehand. They didn't. Weeks after the new iOS was out, the MiND website was updated to include a warning not to upgrade your iOS. Of course it was too late for me and I assume people do not visit websites for all app makers to check the compatibility anyways. It took ages for them to get a version of the software that would run on the new iOS version. Not a sign of active and dedicated development team either.

It's a real shame that good hardware is being let down by crappy software.

[Rufus McDufus]

I agree jjo - I couldn't use the MiND HD app. It simply didn't work for me. I don't think I could even play more than one track without it crashing and it repeatedly failed to detect the MiND. Guillaume had a MiND also and didn't have anything like the same issues with the HD app I had. It was odd. I think we were both using iPad Air 1's at the time with I think the same firmware levels.

[Rufus McDufus]

Oh another issue I had was that the HD app was particularly prone to getting killed by the iOS process reaper. When it deems memory needs freeing it looks for background processes to kill. There's methods of prioritising that and the HD app just got killed all the time. I tend to listen to music and then use Safari to browse the web while I'm listening. Safari tabs, like all browser tabs use quite a lot of memory - several hundred megabytes or more, hence why the reaper was particularly active doing its stuff I guess.
The upshot is the MiND HD app seemed poor at recovery from being killed and the whole MiND detection process plus trying to load up the playlist and library stuff took ages each time. It drove me nuts!
Other control points are prone to this too (Mpad which I'm using now for instance, and Kinsky) but recovery time seems a lot faster and reliable with them when you foreground the app (which is actually restarting the app if it's been reaped) again.

[wiresandmore]

I've used Bubble UPnP on Android, works well with the MiND, no issues!