Quality of Power

[yanc]

Apologies if this has been asked for below ....

At times I think I have a most excellent, articulate, crystal clear, specious, heart warming system ...
But there are hours within the day (hard to be exact) where music sounds flat, and unbearably warm, almost glowing unnaturally.

I can only suspect the quality of electrical current coming in varies during the day.

Is there something I can do to prevent this?

Or
Anything else I should be looking for ...

P.S. This is regardless of quality of power cables

[David A]

What you're describing is the result of noise on the power lines supplying power to your neighbourhood. Usually people find that their system sounds better in the evening after a lot of industry has shut down for the night, people have finished cooking their meals and eating/washing up, and the demand on the grid has dropped significantly.

You can't prevent the problem because the problem is caused by everyone on the grid, and while everyone else individually is making things a very little bit worse for you it's also true that your home is contributing a very little bit to making things worse for everyone else and a lot of people, each contributing a very little bit to a problem, end up making the problem bigger. Also, other electrical devices in your home are pumping noise into your household circuits which is being passed to your system. One thing you can do is to have an electrician instal a separate line from your mains board to a wall connection for your audio system so that the power supply to your system is isolated to a degree from every other electrical device in your home.

After that, or instead if you wish but I think having the separate line to your system is the best start and also the cheapest option you can also consider cleaning up the power going to your system even further with a power conditioner. There are lots of them out there and they all make different claims. The good ones are helpful, the bad ones do little, and I haven't tried them all. Judging from comments from users here, we've got members who are very happy with products from Audioquest, PS Audio, and Shunyata (listed in alphabetical order because I have only heard PS Audio out of those 3 brands and they seem to be the big names at the moment though there are lots of others). They each use different approaches and availability can depend on your location. For example Audioquest power products aren't available in Australia where I am and not all Shunyata models are available.

If you want to try one, consider what's available in your area and whether you can borrow one for a trial, and also consider the number of power outlets you need for your system. Everyone makes difference models and cost goes up with effectiveness within each manufacturer's range so think of your budget. Try before you buy and try over a couple of days when you're home for large parts of the day so you can see what they do at different times and decide whether they are effective with your power situation.

[BoyScout]

I feel the same very often, and subscribe every @David A word. I´m working on that same process.

[bernardl]

I have personally found that the Export Pro CI are less sensitive to power quality that the original D-Premier, but I still saw healthy benefits from my former PS Audio PS10 and now Shunyata Everest that's even better.

One thing to note is that, as advised by David, even if you have a dedicated line, other components in the system in the immediate vicinity of your amp do also generate some noise and are impacted themselves by noise.

Cheers,
Bernard

[markush]

It's as mentioned. The only solution is a sophisticated Power solution for your setup (there are various vendors like PS Audio, Shunyata, IsoTek etc. but it seems the Niagara 3000 / 5000 provides the best value/performance after extensive testing.)
And it's really astonishing to see what a difference power quality makes to the overal performance of the Devialet. Try to lean a few of those device to experience on your own.

[Manfred]

I had the monday to thursday and the friday, saturday and sunday sound.

I have invested in AQ Niagara 1000 + 2x AQ Blizzard (one to D220Pro) and for my Media Renderer with SOTm tx-USBexp pcie card into an external Pauly Hynes SR4BT-12 LPSU with AQ-Z3. 

The difference is small now. The biggest enhancement was to power the SOTm tx-USBexp via external LPSU instead of using my Seasonic internal Computer PSU.

[Confused]

I often wonder how much of the perceived influence of the sound due to variations in the mains is perhaps more a case of variations in what is being listened to and the listeners mood at the time of listening. I do sometimes think my system sounds better on a Sunday morning, but maybe I just tend to be in a more relaxed mood on a Sunday morning? (As it happens, I do tend to be in a far more relaxed mood on Sunday mornings!)

So here is a question, is there a practical way to actually measure the quality of your mains? I suspect the quality of the mains is probably relatively good where happen to live, so I would like some way to actually test this before rushing out to spend lots of cash on a mains conditioner or similar.

[David A]

@Confused

The PS Audio Power Plants have an info screen which provides some information about the quality of the incoming and outgoing power, displayed as a percentage for THD at the line frequency. In my case it normally shows a figure for incoming THD between 1.4 and 1.8% and there is some correlation between that level and time of day since the incoming distortion is usually lower after8.00 pm at night and higher at times when there is peak demand on the grid. The outgoing distortion figure is stable at 0.1%.

I have no way of verifying those figures but I can say that the incoming distortion levels do seem to correlate with my perception of the time when the system would normally sound at its best, and the unvarying figure for outgoing distortion also correlates with the fact that I no longer notice the same variations in sound quality. My P12 power plant also regulates the voltage and the info display also shows incoming and outgoing line voltage. The figures for the incoming voltage, normally somewhere between 240 and 250 V, sometimes a bit higher than 250 V, agree with the display of another device which provides voltage regulation when used in my area so that's some degree of validation of the data it displays for incoming voltage which gives me some confidence that the distortion figure might also be in the ball park.

So, as a practical approach, you could "kill 2 birds with one stone" by borrowing a PS Audio power plant for a home trial and using it to check what your incoming power is like while also finding out whether it makes a difference to sound quality in your system. You'd probably also want to check out a conditioner such as a Shunyata or Audioquest which works by filtering the distortion as a comparison to the power plant which regenerates relatively distortion free AC power.

[BoyScout]

I noticed there´s a difference (probably quite remarkable...) between power plants and power conditioners.
But both has the same objective: provide clean and stable current with the least noise possible.
There´s a price to pay for that difference. Is it justifiable in a same price range?

@David A, you own a PS Audio P12, did you try the other way?

[David A]

I noticed there´s a difference (probably quite remarkable...) between power plants and power conditioners.
But both has the same objective: provide clean and stable current with the least noise possible.
There´s a price to pay for that difference. Is it justifiable in a same price range?

@David A, you own a PS Audio P12, did you try the other way?

Before I got the P12 I was using an Isotek Aquarius but I wasn't happy with the result. The Aquarius made a positive difference most of the time but I felt that it wasn't delivering the power required on transients/high volume passages and that things weren't quite as good as they were without the conditioner at those times. Dynamic limitations seem to be the weak point of a lot of conditioners.

I wanted to try a Shunyata Denali but they weren't available in Australia. The local distributor was listing them as "coming soon" and they were supposedly undergoing testing for certification for sale here in Australia so I waited, and waited, and waited. After 6 months or so of waiting, and with still no sign of a local release date for the Denali, I borrowed a P5, the prior model which the P12 replaced, from my dealer to see how it worked and placed an order for a P12 a few hours after hooking up the P5 in my system. That was nearly 2 years ago now and the Denali still has not been released in Australia. Like they say, a bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush but in this case a bird in the hand is worth an infinite number of non-birds in the bush. I would also have tried Audioquest if their Niagara series was available in Australia but it's not.

As you'll see from my signature, all of my power cables are Shunyata and I'm very impressed with them. I still wonder what a Shunyata conditioner would do in my system but at present the only Shunyata conditioner available in Australia is the Venom distributor and I want something better than that. There are indications that the new V2 Denali and the Everest may be released in Australia and I'll try to get a listen to them if and when they are released. I have no idea how they would compare to the P12 but I suspect that one thing I might miss with the Shunyata's is the voltage regulation the power plants provide since my voltage here is usually between 240-250 Volts, sometimes a bit higher, and the correct line voltage should be 230 Voltls.