My thoughts on Devialet

[blair.athol]

I'm with @flohmann on this one.  I think the OP is confusing two separate issues.  One is retail undercutting, the other is a general dissatisfaction with how Devialet is treating its customers.  The dissatisfaction with Devialet thing I can understand, especially if the communication and software issues bother you.  Retail undercutting is a universal problem, and is in no way unique to Devialet.  I also note that some of the mathematics in the first couple of posts is a little random, with a $50K amp being worth $15K, versus 45 cents to the dollar.  Maybe this is referring to second-hand values?  Plus, as far as I am aware, even someone engaging in very aggressive retail undercutting could not offer a new product for a full 65% off retail.  Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm being picky here, maybe I have misunderstood.

Various "retail undercutting" practices are very common in this world of ours, and they range from what you might consider to be "healthy competition" to other practices that are actually illegal.  Mixed in with this is a moral element, which like most moral issues is never black and white.

The OP refers to getting "wine and donuts" from a dealer.  I suspect that what he means by this is that anything you get for a dealer is of a relatively superficial value, the dealer simply exists to act as a middle man and take a cut of your money.  This can be true.  If you want to buy product X, there are two ways you can buy product X, you might as well go with the lowest cost option, which could be the internet rather than a dealer in the posh part of town.  In the case of audio products, very often this is not the case.  The better dealers will offer a range of products, will let you listen to whatever combinations you want to try, will suggest alternatives to try, and in many cases will let you try kit at home.  If you are interested in making high cost long term audio purchases, this kind of service can be of enormous value in assisting an individual in getting the product that is right for them.  Of course, this kind of service can never come for free, the dealer has to pay for the rent on his "bricks and mortar" sore, staff costs, business rates, and all the rest of it.  To sustain all of this, as flohmann mentions, dealer mark-ups are necessarily high.

All of the above creates opportunities.  You could get a dealer (or trader) who decides that rather than go for the good service / high mark-up thing, he will try go low margin and high volume.  In some cases this might be legitimate, an authorised dealer who simply tries to offer a better deal than his rivals.  In other cases this might not be legitimate, an unauthorised dealer who has somehow managed to get a wholesale supply of a product, and sells at a significant discount in the hope of making enough sales to make it fanatically worthwhile.  There are a range of ways this can be done, some of which are legal, some of which are not.  Some traders involved in retail undercutting  (legal or otherwise) might aggressively pursue potential purchasers by following forums, seeing who might be interested in product X, send the a PM saying "hey, I can do you product X for 65% retail".  Maybe great news for the individual getting the offer, but very bad news for the dealers trying to offer a good service as it will suck a large number of sales globally to just one aggressive trader.  Many fine dealers offering good service can be damaged by practices like this, with just one guy profiteering.  Companies like Devialet, and others, will be aware of such practices , and where illegal will try to shut it down, so some of these deals and opportunities can be transient in nature.

We then have the more complex moral issues.  As an example, I could visit a number of dealers, have lots of demos, try some kit at home.  At the end of this, I might decide I want to buy a Devialet amplifier, or anything else for that matter.  On a moral level, it would be right to buy from the dealer that allowed you to audition the product, maybe let you try one at home to help you make up your mind.  On the other hand, you might consider that your moral responsibility is to provide the maximum for your family, so stuff the dealer, I'll buy a highly discounted item from the other guy.

The problem with retail undercutting is that it is destroying traditional retailers.  I was chatting to someone recently about the new TV that they had bought.  He mentioned two local retailers, he visited both, viewed the TV's there.  He then made the comment that the demonstrations and the knowledge of the sales staff where vastly better at one of these retailers than the other, he had huge praise for one particular sales guy, who apparently explained the differences in features well enough to change the mind of this individual in terms of which product he should buy.  After this, he bought the selected TV at the very best price he could find on the internet.  You can get away with this at the moment, but it does rely on a proportion of the population to buy from the traditional retailer.  If we all do it, the retailers will disappear.  In contrast to this tail, last time I bought a TV, I did lots of research, and narrowed my choice to two products.  I managed to find a dealer that offered both, I called them and asked if I could demo them together.  When I arrived at the store, they had set up the two TV's with identical Blu-ray players, they offered a choice of discs to watch, and they played identical sequences from the discs on each of the two TV's.  They even gave me a cup of coffee (but no donuts), which was appreciated at the time, although this was far from the most important part of the visit.  Interestingly, I arrived at the store 90% certain of which one I was going to buy, I had pretty much decided on my choice, but having seen them for real, I bought the other one.  The service in the store was top class, I knew that I could then leave and get the product cheaper elsewhere, but I did not, I bought it there and then.   

Before buying my first Devialet, I listened to a lot of rival products, pretty much everything I could practically get my hands on.  This meant engaging with a lot of very fine dealers, and I actually feel a little guilty that I could not give business to all of them.  I have benefitted from this though, when making my final choice I did it empowered by almost invaluable information, that is that in terms of the sound quality that I was looking for, it was Devialet over the many rivals that delivered what I was looking for.  Just knowing this is important.  If I had bought a Devialet on a hunch, from some guy "blowing these out his ass for 45 cents on the dollar", then I would always be wondering if maybe there was something else out there I might prefer.  Because of all this, when I do get to the point of actually parting with money, I will always give it to those offering the service I value, which may not be the entity offering the lowest price.  There is huge value in knowing clearly in your mind that you have bought the right product for what you are after.  As for those dealers where I auditioned products but I did not buy, I still remember that good service.  A while ago I was looking for something fairly obscure, I found a number of places on the 'net that could supply.  One of these was a dealer that I visited maybe five years ago but did not buy from because I preferred a rival product demonstrated elsewhere.  After all these years that good service was remembered, and a little bit of custom went their way.

I think this is right, others may take a different approach.  It is a free world, and we are all free to make our own moral and economic choices, as long as it is legal of course.

I have not posted on our forum for quite a while because I am just enjoying the music and the great sound and happiness my Devialet 220 Pro CI brings into my life. I always enjoyed the good sense of culture and british humor in our forum and last but not least I really appreciated Confused well educated reply to the original post (which was out of question agressive and using slang language which I think we should avoid here). Thank you Confused!