A Confused streaming system - Mutec / SOtM Ultra

[alandbush]

Heresy, I suspect, but the Devialet does enable frequency modification, does it not?
Or is the brightness not frequency related?

What about upsampling or downsampling? Or is this, like the above, an unnecessary band aid?

You know, just in the case of a mixed result.

[Confused]

Heresy, I suspect, but the Devialet does enable frequency modification, does it not?
Or is the brightness not frequency related?

What about upsampling or downsampling? Or is this, like the above, an unnecessary band aid?

You know, just in the case of a mixed result.

I wouldn't say heresy but I know what you mean!  If you get everything sounding just so with the tone controls set flat, then that is how it should be.  If you need to tweak the treble down a few dB, it kind of implies something is amiss elsewhere. 

Plus I do not think it is just the difference in brightness, it is more that this is making a slight 'digital edge' more apparent.  The good folk on Computer Audiophile claim that the SOtM kit needs something like 200 hours of running before it sounds right.  Maybe there is something in this, who knows?  Anyway, I have left the system streaming from Roon 24/7.  So whatever burn in might or might not do, it's doing it now!

Upsampling is an interesting one.  I do use HQPlayer to upsample PCM.  I have spent much time trying the different filters in HQPlayer to find the one that suits the system best.  Maybe with the SOtM kit & REF10 in place I need slightly different settings to that with the microRendu.  Definitely something I need to experiment with.

[zdenes]

You have probably seen it, there is another post where both SOtM gear and Ultrarendu play a part, albeit there is a lot more in this post.
https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forum...ent-792071

[SwissBear]

You have probably seen it, there is another post where both SOtM gear and Ultrarendu play a part, albeit there is a lot more in this post.
https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forum...ent-792071

Thanks for sharing @zdenes . But at the same time, this is not so cool. Now we have no more excuses not to spend thousands of Euros on Habst clock cables  

[Confused]

You have probably seen it, there is another post where both SOtM gear and Ultrarendu play a part, albeit there is a lot more in this post.
https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forum...ent-792071

Thanks for sharing @zdenes . But at the same time, this is not so cool. Now we have no more excuses not to spend thousands of Euros on Habst clock cables  

Yes, I thought the same thing.  The comments on the Habst were very positive, something along the lines of the improvement over the RG216 being similar to the improvement of adding the REF10 itself.  I find this a little hard to believe, but even if a slight exaggeration, this is still a very positive comment.

I was also interested in the comparison of the ultraRendu and the SOtM kit.  This was clearly in favour of the SOtM bundle.  I very nearly bought the ultraRendu rather than the SOtM bundle, but now I am not 100% sure about that choice.  I am very much looking forward to doing a few comparisons myself this weekend to sort my thoughts out on this one.

EDIT: I note some more recent comments on CA. The Habst cable used was 0.5m, the RG216 was 36". Mindful that cable length is critical, the Habst did have the advantage of being shorter. (roughly half the length in this case) When I get time, I will try my 12" RG216 versus my 24" RG216 between the REF10 and MC3+USB, to see if this kind of length reduction makes a discernible difference. Maybe some of the Habst magic was simply due to it being the shorter cable?

[Confused]

An update of my adventures with the Mutec REF10 and SOtM 'bundle'. One week ago I was posting that whilst I could detect some real magic with the SOtM kit, I did have some reservations, specifically a slightly unpleasant 'glassy' characteristic, or a slight 'digital edge'. I have said before that I am not a great believer in 'burn in', but the advice from quite a few people was that the SOtM kit needs 100 hours, 200 hours, maybe more. I have spent the vast majority of last week 'away from my system', but I did leave the SOtM kit streaming away. It says something about the stability of the SOtM kit that fed from Roon with a playlist many days long, it was still streaming away this morning, five days straight without a hitch.

Anyway, due to my reservations about the SOtM kit, I had decided that today I would try running some experiments, switching my old faithful microRendu in and out of the system. Prior to doing this, I spent some time simply listening to the new set-up, which is sMS-200Ultra to tX-USBultra (sPS-500 Powered), to Mutec MC3+USB, with each of these devices clocked from the REF10. First to say, I was a lot happier with the way everything was sounding today. In addition, I had had a few thoughts during the week. I run Roon / HQPlayer, and my preferred HQPlayer settings have been honed by many months experimenting using my previous mR / MC3+USB front end. So what I was thinking is that maybe with the SOtM bundle & REF10 in place, maybe I could get a more satisfactory result with different HQPlayer settings. So for a while this morning I tried a few different options in HQPlayer, and even tried simply running Roon RAAT direct. This was an interesting exercise. First to say that I planned to do this to see if the 'glassy' treble could be tamed, but listening this morning indicated that the glassy treble was nowhere near as big an issue as it appeared to be last week. Nevertheless, this was still an interesting exercise. The main conclusion is that with the SOtM bundle and REF10 in place, the system seems far more sensitive to changes in HQPlayer, and the delta between Roon RAAT and HQPlayer is now far more apparent. So I definitely need to spend more time fine-tuning in this area. For the record, HQPlayer provided far more satisfying results than RAAT direct. RAAT did nominally sound a little more 'full fat', but via HQPlayer everything sounded far more nuanced and articulate. At this point I realised that I could spend the rest of the weekend playing with HQPlayer settings, but what I really wanted to do was the mR comparisons, so for now I reverted back to my previously favored poly-sinc-xtr.

In order to establish the influence of the SOtM kit, I planned to try the following:

1. sMS-200Ultra to tX- USBultra to MC3+USB (all REF10 clocked)
2. microRendu to MC3+USB (MC3 clocked by REF10)
3. microRendu to tXUSBUltra to MC3+USB. (tX and MC3 REF10 clocked)

OK, this may appear to some as a little bit of a 'David vs Goliath' test, with the little mR being a fraction of the price of the SOtM kit, and as a spoiler alert, the result is pretty much as you might guess, but there are some subleties in the results that were certainly very interesting and informative to myself.

Going from 1 to 2, there was a loss of detail and subtlety, so where layers in the bass are revealed by 1, this is replaced by a nice solid bass with 2, but some nuances lost. That said, microRendu to MC3+USB (2) was a really good listen, yes some subtleties were lost, but it was not like going from a good front end to a bad one, it was terrific to listen to. So you could say that the microRendu to MC3+USB was a nice easy listen, but ultimately lacks the resolution and subtleties of the sMS-200Ultra to tX- USBultra.

Then on to 3, adding the tXUSBUltra in between the mR and the MC3+USB. This was actually a bit of a revelation, adding the tXUSBUltra somehow retained the pleasant character of the mR, but everything was so much sharper and in focus, plus overall dynamics were improved. I actually spent quite a lot of time listening to this set-up, somehow it suited me, just plain thoroughly enjoyable to listen to.

Having enjoyed 3 so much, it was then back to 1, and yes, it is the best, with the sMS-200ultra back in the chain simply adds in those subtle nuances.

So am I 100% happy with the SOtM bundle? No, but I am now an order of magnitude happier with it than I was a week ago.

Plus, I am not finished yet. A couple of hours ago Mr Postman arrived, delivering the 12v 3A Lithium Ion battery pack that I had ordered. I bought this for a number of reasons, one of these reasons is that I have a non-audio related use for it, but the other reason results from a suggestion from a guy on Computer Audiophile. OK, before anyone jumps in on this one, I know enough about audio power to know that a battery is no substitute for a decent LPSU, low output impedance and all that good stuff. But it does offer the chance to get an idea of what an LPSU might do. Let's say for example that the battery kills dynamics, but does help clean up that last touch of glassy treble, then maybe I should be looking at adding a LPSU or two. (Now where is that rabbit hole....) I have other things to do now, so that is an experiment for tomorrow.

Meanwhile, I am now pretty happy, with a bit of fine tuning I should be there. Plus, I still have the SOtM modded switch to try. After installing the SOtM kit, I deliberately left this out of the system, a case of me not wanting to change too many things at once, but now I think I am ready to give it a go.

To be continued ......

[octaviars]

@Confused have you tried running SMS Ultra directly to Mutec? I have the possibillity to get a secondhand tX-USBultra and a Paul Hynes SR4 to add that to my existing SMS Ultra and SR4. But I really dont know if it will be worth the money and how much it will affect the sound that allready is very very good.

I know my self that if i get the tX then I will be thinking what if I get them modded to accept a masterclock and get a mastercklock and so on.......I told myself that after I got the SR4 for my SMS Ultra I would stop thinking af more stuff

[Confused]

@Confused have you tried running SMS Ultra directly to Mutec? I have the possibillity to get a secondhand tX-USBultra and a Paul Hynes SR4 to add that to my existing SMS Ultra and SR4. But I really dont know if it will be worth the money and how much it will affect the sound that allready is very very good.

I know my self that if i get the tX then I will be thinking what if I get them modded to accept a masterclock and get a mastercklock and so on.......I told myself that after I got the SR4 for my SMS Ultra I would stop thinking af more stuff

Today I tried exactly this, I saw your post yesterday but as it happens I was keen to try this anyway, I do like to understand what each component is adding, or indeed taking away, from the system.

I am glad I did this, one thing that is now clear is that the slight harshness that I am experiencing with some material is resulting from the sMS-200Ultra, not the tX-USBultra, but at the same time I can see that the sMS-200Ultra is producing some real magic.  All the tX does is improve things! 

To answer your question, I would put it this way, as a system, I would rather have the microRendu + tX-USBultra than the sMS-200Ultra on it's own.  One other thing I would say, if you don't want that SR4, can I buy it please!

Regarding getting a clock for the tX, I did a bit of experimenting today.  With the REF10 it is easy to turn off individual clock feeds.  To be honest, I need to spend more time with this, my brain is a bit frazzled with endless A/B testing this weekend.  But in short, adding the REF10 to the MC3+USB seams to make a big improvement in my system.  Turning off the clock signals to the tX-USBultra and / or sMS-200Ultra does not seem to make very much of a difference at all.  Controversial I know, but that is the impression I got with a quick test.  To reiterate, I do need to spend some more time with this one, but my thoughts so far is that one Habst (or maybe a nice Shunyata) clock cable is all I will ever buy.

I also spent some time experimenting with battery power today, with tX out of the chain I tried a battery power supply on the sMS-200Ultra, and this did seem to help the harshness issue somewhat.  Adding the tXUSBUltra back in the chain simply improves everything, the negatives are mitigated to a degree, and more positives emerge.  Trying battery power was an interesting experiment.   With the tXUSBultra back in the chain  I tried every option possible between battery power and the sPS-500.  It was a little strange that with the sMS-200Ultra on battery power direct to the MC3+USB, this seemed to take the edge off the harshness.  Powering both the tX and sMS with a battery versus the sPS-500, or trying battery power with one, sPS-500 with the other, all seemed to yield similar results, remarkably similar.

Another interesting point, the little battery pack I bought (see link below) was quite happy powering both the sMS-200Ultra and tXUSBUltra, together with a 'Y' cable.

 
[u]https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B072HR211P/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1[/u]

It did get to the point that I had A/B tested so much that I just had to stop!  So there may have been some marginal differences but after a day and a half of A/B testing it was time to stop.  So I decided to give up, rearranged the kit back in the shelf, and have just been enjoying some music, and as it happens, the system is sounding terrific now! 
 
I'll revisit the battery power and clock feeds to the SOtM kit one another day, I've done too much this weekend!

[octaviars]

To answer your question, I would put it this way, as a system, I would rather have the microRendu + tX-USBultra than the sMS-200Ultra on it's own.  One other thing I would say, if you don't want that SR4, can I buy it please!

I have seen so many positive comments regarding both the sMS-200Ultra and the tX-USBultra but the tX seems to be the star of them both.....I feel that I will have a tX in my system in the near future

I think that second SR4 will stay in my system 

I am looking forward to hear about your impressions of the clocked switch. I have a Netgear GS108 modded with -0V connected to ground but some thoughts of sending my sms Ultra and switch to SOtM to get them modified with clock connections is on my mind.

[alandbush]

@Confused
You must have boundless energy and patience. I don’t think I could cope with that many changes.
Fascinating reading even if I have no intention of ever trying any of the items in question.
I have plenty to keep me busy refining FIR filters for my Phantoms.

Anyhoo, to my question and please forgive me if I have missed the answer to this in earlier posts.
I believe you prefer the Devialet aes input and use the Mutec to convert usb to aes?
Now that you have all of this wonderful new kit, should you also revisit the Devialet usb input, especially with the txusbultra which appears to be the star performer.