New speakers SAM ready

[Mikeeo]

Hi,

Re-configured my SD cards tonight to prepare for Raidho X1. Cards OK but when slotting them in again I still have the same setting as before ie no SAM on/off or no adjustment possibility in 'tone' setting. Anyone else experienced this? In a quest to find something I pressed buttons here and there, long and short but nothing, until I pressed the source button a little longer. Then I was transfered to some total overview of the system with indications of source and power used at the moment etc etc, the round screen was totally over crowded with info. I tried to get back/out of this but nothing helped until I just turned the juice off. On restart everything was OK again, but no SAM by the way.
Recently I am mostly thrown out of my configuration and I have to log in again, maybe that is the reason I didn't manage to get SAM?

By the way, I also renamed my in- and outputs puts but that didn't register either.

I also just had a look at the dp_cfg.txt files I downloaded and notice that they all are marked with "you don't have the right to this request" and that 0 Kb has been downloaded which may explain the above.

I am so lost with this and disappointed about the function...

/Mike

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... and with that disappointment above I just wrote an angry letter to Devialet and asked them to go to h...

Enclosed the message I get all the time! And after that I am automatically logged out.

---

Hi,

Just fooled around a bit with my profile and the configurator. When I changed my speakers to Raidho X1 for my profile, then suddenly it works, isn't that strange and why can't Devialet say something about this????

And......it works, this logic that if I havn't registrated 'my' speaker as the one I want SAMed I will not be allowed to use SAM.

Not my logic at least....

[Mikeeo]

Hello again,

Can you believe it, I found my current speakers SAM:ed, the Monitor Audio PL100. Compared to the difference that I experienced with SAM:ed Accordo my loudspeakers respond very moderately on SAM, somewhat deeper bass (specced with SAM to 33 Hz) but not as impressive as with Accordo. The phase correction that was the most impressive with the Accordo is hardly present with my speakers. Is it that good already or is the SAM PL100 not as good performed?
Well, Raidho X1 will do the duty tomorrow, these will have SAM:ed bass to 24 Hz, always something I guess.

/Mike

[PhilP]

Hello again,

Can you believe it, I found my current speakers SAM:ed, the Monitor Audio PL100. Compared to the difference that I experienced with SAM:ed Accordo my loudspeakers respond very moderately on SAM, somewhat deeper bass (specced with SAM to 33 Hz) but not as impressive as with Accordo. The phase correction that was the most impressive with the Accordo is hardly present with my speakers. Is it that good already or is the SAM PL100 not as good performed?
Well, Raidho X1 will do the duty tomorrow, these will have SAM:ed bass to 24 Hz, always something I guess.

/Mike

That's interesting. Looking at the with and without SAM charts for the two speakers on the Devialet site one might expect that the PL100 would benefit more from phase correction. I guess it just shows that things don't always work how you might expect

[Pim]

@Pim van Vliet:

Please post your impressions of the SAM effect on these Dynaudio's.

Hi Charlemagne,

Well, I've spent a few days at home and had some time to have a play. Whilst I was away we had an air conditioner installed and they moved my speakers so when I came home I had to re-do my set-up. From what I had read about SAM I knew that the added bass would probably mean I had to make minor changes to my set up anyway so I was kind of prepared to do so.
I decided to set SAM to 100% and start with the set up. I was playing Mutineers by David Gray; A fantastic album but I just couldn't get Davids voice right. It kept sounding harsh and at times I wondered whether or not it had to do with SAM so I turned it on and off to hear a difference. It was subtle but it was there; without SAM the voice was less harsh but only by a tiny bit. That night I was quite frustrated with it all and went to bed a little disappointed. The added bass depth though was definitely there and fun.

The next night I just wanted to enjoy the music. I made some minor changes to the set up; A little closer to each other and more forward tilt (They sit quite high so need a lot of tilt) I left them there and just played music.

This time it was different.
1. I was listening to some acoustic guitar that always had some low end bits in it that I thought was added by a bass guitar. Without SAM that's what you would think. With SAM it clearly was the bass from the guitar cabinet. So the bass was lower in frequency but not louder. If anything probably a little less loud. But it was better defined and let the timbre of the guitar shine through better.
This I considered a big +

2. I wanted to feel the bass cranking and put on some Lorde. The bass again was clearly deeper but this is music you want to crank up and the thumping bass hangs around the 50-ish Hz and when SAM is on it lets through a much lower frequency which requires more cone movement. And then when you crank it up SAM kicks in its 'safety net' and wipes out all the bass. So it sounds good at lower volume but as soon as you go a little too loud all the bass disappears. I found with SAM off I enjoyed it more. I think SAM is a little too protective and kicks in too early. Then again, you're asking more from your cones with SAM on so it's hard to tell.
I consider this a - but at least I didn't blow my cones to pieces.

3. I can't tell if it was SAM or my renewed setup but on that second night I had the most satisfying night of music listening I had ever had. Until I put David Gray on again. His voice was still harsh and this time clearly more so with SAM on than off. I found the link to the Dynamic Range site and looked up Mutineers; The DR was quite bad. Conclusion; Although the musical production is one of the most enjoyable to my ears, the compression ruined it.
What I learned from this is what I've read here a number of times; SAM makes the mid range (voices) sound a bit more forward, which just isn't a good thing when the engineers have already set the level to IN YOUR FACE!
This I consider + on some songs and a - on Mutineers and possibly others.

So, is SAM a good thing? Yes! It gives a clearer picture of the music as it was put on disc (not as the artist had intended as we're being thrown to death with thanks to Neil Young) If the recording is good, SAM will make it better.
Would I set SAM to 100% and never touch it again? No. Sometimes I just want the thumping 50Hz tones and crank it up. Maybe once I get some subs or when my room is made smaller (We're renovating and this room will be cut in half to become the bedroom with the 200/C1 system in it) I can fully enjoy it all the time.

Unfortunately I'm back at the rig and will have to wait another few weeks before I can have another listen. And I'm soon looking forward to it.

Since you're Dutch you might want to try this song; Hilversum 3 by Herman van Veen. I only have an mp3 but it's so much fun to listen to.

Cheers,

Pim

[Eddye]

@Pim van Vliet:

Please post your impressions of the SAM effect on these Dynaudio's.

Hi Charlemagne,

Well, I've spent a few days at home and had some time to have a play. Whilst I was away we had an air conditioner installed and they moved my speakers so when I came home I had to re-do my set-up. From what I had read about SAM I knew that the added bass would probably mean I had to make minor changes to my set up anyway so I was kind of prepared to do so.
I decided to set SAM to 100% and start with the set up. I was playing Mutineers by David Gray; A fantastic album but I just couldn't get Davids voice right. It kept sounding harsh and at times I wondered whether or not it had to do with SAM so I turned it on and off to hear a difference. It was subtle but it was there; without SAM the voice was less harsh but only by a tiny bit. That night I was quite frustrated with it all and went to bed a little disappointed. The added bass depth though was definitely there and fun.

The next night I just wanted to enjoy the music. I made some minor changes to the set up; A little closer to each other and more forward tilt (They sit quite high so need a lot of tilt) I left them there and just played music.

This time it was different.
1. I was listening to some acoustic guitar that always had some low end bits in it that I thought was added by a bass guitar. Without SAM that's what you would think. With SAM it clearly was the bass from the guitar cabinet. So the bass was lower in frequency but not louder. If anything probably a little less loud. But it was better defined and let the timbre of the guitar shine through better.
This I considered a big +

2. I wanted to feel the bass cranking and put on some Lorde. The bass again was clearly deeper but this is music you want to crank up and the thumping bass hangs around the 50-ish Hz and when SAM is on it lets through a much lower frequency which requires more cone movement. And then when you crank it up SAM kicks in its 'safety net' and wipes out all the bass. So it sounds good at lower volume but as soon as you go a little too loud all the bass disappears. I found with SAM off I enjoyed it more. I think SAM is a little too protective and kicks in too early. Then again, you're asking more from your cones with SAM on so it's hard to tell.
I consider this a - but at least I didn't blow my cones to pieces.

3. I can't tell if it was SAM or my renewed setup but on that second night I had the most satisfying night of music listening I had ever had. Until I put David Gray on again. His voice was still harsh and this time clearly more so with SAM on than off. I found the link to the Dynamic Range site and looked up Mutineers; The DR was quite bad. Conclusion; Although the musical production is one of the most enjoyable to my ears, the compression ruined it.
What I learned from this is what I've read here a number of times; SAM makes the mid range (voices) sound a bit more forward, which just isn't a good thing when the engineers have already set the level to IN YOUR FACE!
This I consider + on some songs and a - on Mutineers and possibly others.

So, is SAM a good thing? Yes! It gives a clearer picture of the music as it was put on disc (not as the artist had intended as we're being thrown to death with thanks to Neil Young) If the recording is good, SAM will make it better.
Would I set SAM to 100% and never touch it again? No. Sometimes I just want the thumping 50Hz tones and crank it up. Maybe once I get some subs or when my room is made smaller (We're renovating and this room will be cut in half to become the bedroom with the 200/C1 system in it) I can fully enjoy it all the time.

Unfortunately I'm back at the rig and will have to wait another few weeks before I can have another listen. And I'm soon looking forward to it.

Since you're Dutch you might want to try this song; Hilversum 3 by Herman van Veen. I only have an mp3 but it's so much fun to listen to.

Cheers,

Pim

Great read, Pim. Very clear. When you back home you could listen to Samantha Crain's song Paint from the album Kid Face. That song has a great bass.

[Charlemagne]

Thanx Pim for the excellent comment. I do wonder if you have been testing several percentages of SAM. I myself don't use SAM, as my Dynaudio Sapphires are not SAM'd yet (only 6 votes till now), but I've been reading that should be possible.

About your tip about Herman van Veen: I heard it on Qobuz as a lossless flac. Nice song and well recorded (in Dutch). Dynaudio's are really excellent in reproducing human voices, that's what I experience time over time again.

[wiresandmore]

Interesting - matches my demo experience - while SAM is a great innovation, I couldn't say on all tracks all of the time it was better. Some implementations (the PMC's) were better than others. As mentioned earlier, and very much to my surprise, the Olympicas didn't work as well as I had expected, certainly with SAM they were overpowering on some tracks.

[f1eng]

I wonder if the SAM correction could take the level up to digital clipping on some heavily compressed recordings which are only about 1 bit from clipping as released?
They sound pretty rubbish to me already

[Pim]

Thanx Pim for the excellent comment. I do wonder if you have been testing several percentages of SAM. I myself don't use SAM, as my Dynaudio Sapphires are not SAM'd yet (only 6 votes till now), but I've been reading that should be possible.

About your tip about Herman van Veen: I heard it on Qobuz as a lossless flac. Nice song and well recorded (in Dutch). Dynaudio's are really excellent in reproducing human voices, that's what I experience time over time again.

Ah Mate,
Weren't there only 1000 Sapphires made? Very unlikely that 10% of Sapphire owners also own a Devialet. I think you'll just have to drop them in the back of your car and cruise them over to Paris
I've had a quick try with different percentages but couldn't hear a difference. I need more time with them but this bloody job that pays for it all get in the way...
Glad you liked Herman. I don't stream so I'll have to buy Samantha Crain to listen to it. Will have a look when I'm back home and on a land line internet connection.

[Charlemagne]

Ah Mate,
Weren't there only 1000 Sapphires made? Very unlikely that 10% of Sapphire owners also own a Devialet. I think you'll just have to drop them in the back of your car and cruise them over to Paris

That's right! The 1000 pair of Sapphires are sold out. I can tell you that they do match very well with the Devialet, even when not yet SAM'd.