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Sound differences between Devialet 200 and Devialet 250
#1
Hello guys,

This is my first post here, so I first like to say hello to all of you and also I want to present my current set up briefly and will assign you with some questions about your opinions about the sonic differences between the D200 and the D250 because I have planned to make some changes in my current set up.

Current set up consists of a Pass Labs Int.150 integrated amp. in combination with Kharma 3.2 CE speakers. The digital part of my set up contains a Moon 180 MiND renderer with Teddy Pardo 12/2 power supply combined with the Bryston BDA-1 dac.
Although I am still happy with the good sonic performance of above mentioned set up I have planned to purchase a Devialet 200 or 250.
Reason for this is that I had a Devialet 200 from my dealer on audition here and it sounded great and impressive to me.
The match with my Kharma 3.2 CE,s was so good that my first thoughts were: ''this is a match made in heaven'' !
Compared with the Pass Labs the bass of the D200 was absolutely thighter and faster, spaciousness was bigger, and voices were projected more up front.
The Pass Labs was better on the following aspects: separation of voices and instruments and more depth in the soundstage.
Overall impressions of the combination D200 and Kharma were so good that I have decided to sell my 14 months old Pass Labs Int.150 now.
But the my prevailing question is: how much better is the D250 to the D200 if we're  speaking in terms of spaciousness, depth and detail in the soundstage ??
I spoke with two Devialet dealers and they said that the differences between the D200 and D250 are significant... so I like to hear some opinions of users which have listened both.

Thanks in advance !
Amp: Devialet 200 // Renderer: Streacom FC-5 Alpha based audio pc with HDPlex 100W LPS - HDPlex 250W ATX UPS - PPA PCIe USB V2 - Roon Labs core - JPlay - Fidelizer Audio Pro  // Speakers: Kharma 3.2 CE black label upgrade // Active sub: Eton Hexacone 10 '' with Hypex DS 4.0 // Cables: Siltech Explorer 180 L - Acoustic Revive Powermax 10000 + IeGo 8055 - Furutech FP-3TS20 + IeGo 8055 - Acoustic Revive USB 1.OPLS - Belden cat.7 1885 ENH + Telegartner MFP8

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#2
Hi and welcome, I can share my little experience,
Not long ago I upgraded my D200 to D250 and that's after trying D200 in monoblocks (D400).
I liked D250 much better even though according to specs D400 should be superior.
D250 will give you better control of the speaker, more air and dynamics.
Most important thing D250 brought to my system is very sweet sound , with D200 I started to regret that I purchased my d800 diamonds, mostly because those diamond tweeters that were bright and harsh.
Now after upgrade im in heaven, highs are so sweet that I'm enjoying of so much more music , things that before I couldn't listen because of unpleasant and bright sound, I of course blamed it on record quality and my speakers.
I have to be honest and I'll say that D250 was not my only upgrade , I did upgrade DAC and speaker cables ,I chose Stealth audio Reverie which I really liked after my Neotech Sahara (as my dealer said: someone's entire level is other flagship ) and regarding DAC, I found that Linn Akurate DAC is better then Devialet internal DAC and sounds more analog and resolving.
I can share even more, couple of days ago I tried Luxman 700 pre and power (10000$ x2) in my setup , and I liked Devialet more.
Devialet 800| B&W 802 Diamond | JL 113 | Linn Akurate DS + Denon HEOS for Spotify | Stealth Reverie speaker cables| Audioprana AES/RCA | DH LABS PC 
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#3
(18-Oct-2015, 14:32)JeanF Wrote: Hello guys,

This is my first post here, so I first like to say hello to all of you and also I want to present my current set up briefly and will assign you with some questions about your opinions about the sonic differences between the D200 and the D250 because I have planned to make some changes in my current set up.

Current set up consists of a Pass Labs Int.150 integrated amp. in combination with Kharma 3.2 CE speakers. The digital part of my set up contains a Moon 180 MiND renderer with Teddy Pardo 12/2 power supply combined with the Bryston BDA-1 dac.
Although I am still happy with the good sonic performance of above mentioned set up I have planned to purchase a Devialet 200 or 250.
Reason for this is that I had a Devialet 200 from my dealer on audition here and it sounded great and impressive to me.
The match with my Kharma 3.2 CE,s was so good that my first thoughts were: ''this is a match made in heaven'' !
Compared with the Pass Labs the bass of the D200 was absolutely thighter and faster, spaciousness was bigger, and voices were projected more up front.
The Pass Labs was better on the following aspects: separation of voices and instruments and more depth in the soundstage.
Overall impressions of the combination D200 and Kharma were so good that I have decided to sell my 14 months old Pass Labs Int.150 now.
But the my prevailing question is: how much better is the D250 to the D200 if we are re speaking in terms of spacious and depth and detail in the soundstage ??
I spoke with two Devialet dealers and they said that the difference between the D200 and D250 are significant... so I like to hear some opinions of users which have listened both.

Thanks in advance !

HELLO

If You have funds to buy 250 just buy it. 

Best regards.
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#4
(18-Oct-2015, 23:08)Stigmater Wrote: Hi and welcome, I can share my little experience,
Not long ago I upgraded my D200 to D250 and that's after trying D200 in monoblocks (D400).
I liked D250 much better even though according to specs D400 should be superior.
D250 will give you better control of the speaker, more air and dynamics.
Most important thing D250 brought to my system is very sweet sound , with D200 I started to regret that I purchased my d800 diamonds,  mostly because those diamond tweeters that were bright and harsh.
Now after upgrade im in heaven, highs are so sweet that I'm enjoying of so much more music , things that before I couldn't listen because of unpleasant and bright sound, I of course blamed it on record quality and my speakers.
I have to be honest and I'll say that D250 was not my only upgrade , I did upgrade DAC and speaker cables ,I chose Stealth audio Reverie which I really liked after my Neotech Sahara (as my dealer said: someone's entire level is other flagship )  and regarding DAC, I found that Linn Akurate DAC is better then Devialet internal DAC and sounds more analog and resolving.
I can share even more, couple of days ago I tried Luxman 700 pre and power (10000$ x2) in my setup , and I liked  Devialet more.

Are you saying that you connect the Linn DAC to the line input of your D250? You do realise that the signal is then going through the D250 ADC and DAC on its way to the speakers? There is no way to bypass the internal DAC of the Devialet design. You can connect a digital source and avoid the ADC, but if you use an analog signal (phono or line inputs) the signal will be digitised for processing in DSP.
*
Devialetless!
Roon, ROCK/Audiolense XO/Music on NAS/EtherRegen/RoPieee/USPCB/ISORegen/USPCB/Sound Devices USBPre2/Tannoy GOLD 8
250 Pro CI, MicroRendu(1.4), Mutec MC-3+USB
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#5
The internal ADC/DAC in the Devialet is remarkably transparent as a pure amplifier though.
I have it in my head, without much understanding of these things, that this could well be down to algorithms for both the AD and DA processing being more or less the same, but used in reverse in AD compared to DA? Whatever, the evidence seems to be that if you plug a superior DAC into the Devialet via analogue input, you will hear the superiority of that DAC over the Devialet's one.

I started with Devialet by using my Klimax DS (KDS/1 I think - or was it /2 by then, can't remember). I have to admit I've been one of the few who wasn't massively enamoured with the KDS/1, even before owning my Devialet. I've owned a first-gen Akurate DS and also a Renew DS (based on the original KDS/0). The Akurate DS from the second-gen onwards which I'm guessing Stigmater has (?) was vastly superior to the first-gen Akurate DS which I had. The Renew DS based on the KDs/0 was wonderful and I personally preferred it to the KDS/1 (this is almost heresy). What I'm trying to say in a roundabout way is that the second-gen Akurate DS onwards is a great DAC/streamer and should sound terrific into a Devialet via analogue inputs.
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#6
(19-Oct-2015, 07:34)Rufus McDufus Wrote: The internal ADC/DAC in the Devialet is remarkably transparent as a pure amplifier though.
I have it in my head, without much understanding of these things, that this could well be down to algorithms for both the AD and DA processing being more or less the same, but used in reverse in AD compared to DA? Whatever, the evidence seems to be that if you plug a superior DAC into the Devialet via analogue input, you will hear the superiority of that DAC over the Devialet's one.

I started with Devialet by using my Klimax DS (KDS/1 I think - or was it /2 by then, can't remember). I have to admit I've been one of the few who wasn't massively enamoured with the KDS/1, even before owning my Devialet. I've owned a first-gen Akurate DS and also a Renew DS (based on the original KDS/0).  The Akurate DS from the second-gen onwards which I'm guessing Stigmater has (?) was vastly superior to the first-gen Akurate DS which I had. The Renew DS based on the KDs/0 was wonderful and I personally preferred it to the KDS/1 (this is almost heresy).  What I'm trying to say in a roundabout way is that the second-gen Akurate DS onwards is a great DAC/streamer and should sound terrific into a Devialet via analogue inputs.

I am not suggesting the ADC-DAC in the Devialet is not transparent. If it wasn't, the phono input would not be top class. Devialet may indeed have special correction or algorithms in place to improve the AD-DA performance. But connecting analog to the line input is not bypassing the internal processing and everything is digital going through DSP before DA conversion and entering ADH.
*
Devialetless!
Roon, ROCK/Audiolense XO/Music on NAS/EtherRegen/RoPieee/USPCB/ISORegen/USPCB/Sound Devices USBPre2/Tannoy GOLD 8
250 Pro CI, MicroRendu(1.4), Mutec MC-3+USB
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#7
(19-Oct-2015, 07:34)Rufus McDufus Wrote: ...
Whatever, the evidence seems to be that if you plug a superior DAC into the Devialet via analogue input, you will hear the superiority of that DAC over the Devialet's one.
...

Wouldn't it be more accurate to say that if you plug a DAC with a known sound signature into the Devialet, the sound signature is preserved by the Devialet? (Not that I've done the experiment.) That could be equivalent to what you said, depending on what you mean by "superior".
Roon (Mac Mini), Wilson Benesch Full Circle, Expert 1000 Pro CI, Kaiser Chiara
Warwickshire, UK
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#8
(19-Oct-2015, 07:34)Rufus McDufus Wrote: The internal ADC/DAC in the Devialet is remarkably transparent as a pure amplifier though.
I have it in my head, without much understanding of these things, that this could well be down to algorithms for both the AD and DA processing being more or less the same, but used in reverse in AD compared to DA? Whatever, the evidence seems to be that if you plug a superior DAC into the Devialet via analogue input, you will hear the superiority of that DAC over the Devialet's one.

I started with Devialet by using my Klimax DS (KDS/1 I think - or was it /2 by then, can't remember). I have to admit I've been one of the few who wasn't massively enamoured with the KDS/1, even before owning my Devialet. I've owned a first-gen Akurate DS and also a Renew DS (based on the original KDS/0). The Akurate DS from the second-gen onwards which I'm guessing Stigmater has (?) was vastly superior to the first-gen Akurate DS which I had. The Renew DS based on the KDs/0 was wonderful and I personally preferred it to the KDS/1 (this is almost heresy). What I'm trying to say in a roundabout way is that the second-gen Akurate DS onwards is a great DAC/streamer and should sound terrific into a Devialet via analogue inputs.

I own Akurate DS/1 which is until recently was the updated one and better then DS according to forums that i checked, as i understood there is DS/2 now.
Its a little off topic but please share why you didn't liked Klimax that cost 3-4 times more then Akurate and sort of my dream now after i heard what Akurate can do.


Back to topic but with a little twist Smile
I am very curious if we Deviate owners are in the right direction ,
Some people say Devialet sound digital, some say that tube amps a lot better , other say Devialet is just a lifestyle product that only looks good.
What i mean is, i don't have much experience with a lot of other brands of conventional Pre Power combinations
I started to feel that i need to check for my self if and what are the difference between Devialet and other Hi End brands of amplifiers, maybe i missing something and maybe for example PASS amps a lot better.
I cant take all Brands that i want home and examine them so i started where i could , I shared my latest experience with Luxman 700u amp that i was a little disappointed of, the sound that came out of my speakers was too bright and fatigue for my taste , the only upside was the better control of bass which is very important and it was better then Devialet's, but after i reconnect back Devialet i felt a relief , sound was much more enjoyable despite the Bass .

By the way i really started to enjoy my setup only after upgrade from D200 to D250 and added external DAC.

I really would like to hear your experience with Hi End brands that you compared to Devilaet and your insights about it.

PS. Please advice if i should add another D250 (D800) how better my setup will become, the only thing my setup is missing now is better Bass control.
I don't know yet if i can afford another D250 but please advice anyway.
Devialet 800| B&W 802 Diamond | JL 113 | Linn Akurate DS + Denon HEOS for Spotify | Stealth Reverie speaker cables| Audioprana AES/RCA | DH LABS PC 
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#9
I found the D-Premier to be transparent, in as much as the characteristic colour of the various analogue components I plugged into the analogue inputs came through.
I tried it with the built in phono system in my EMT turntable, a Goldmund Mimesis 20 DAC, Goldmund Ph2 phono stage and a Lynx Theta tuner (a stylish case around a Magnum Dynalab unit).

In my view it is passing all audible colourations through, harsh or euphonic.

If one prefers the sound of a DAC into the analogue input it will be because one prefers those particular added colours, not because it is better in terms of being of higher fidelity than the internal DAC, not that there is anything wrong with that, I still listen to LPs!
Devialet Original d'Atelier 44 Core, Job Pre/225, Goldmund PH2, Goldmund Reference/T3f /Ortofon A90, Goldmund Mimesis 36+ & Chord Blu, iMac/Air, Lynx Theta, Tune Audio Anima, Goldmund Epilog 1&2, REL Studio. Dialog, Silver Phantoms, Branch stands, copper cables (mainly).
Oxfordshire

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#10
I'm not saying there isn't any deterioration with 'stacking DACs' but the Devialet is considerably better in my experience as a pure amplifier for analogue sources than logic would suggest it is.

Linn KDS/1 - I just felt the cost didn't really justify the improvement. It was the best out of the KDS/1, ADS/1, Renew DS/0. The ADS/1 is maybe less nuanced and maybe works best with rock music. The Renew DS/0 (i.e KDS/0) sounded more 'analogue' to me and I have to admit I had more pleasure listening to it than the KDS/1, of which I was perhaps expecting more. It could just be my system was better matched when I had the Renew DS/0 and perhaps I took a wrong turn somewhere.

I was a Linnie for perhaps 14 years purely because of the system synergy and the guarantee it would sound good without needing lots of auditioning. Testing separates from different manufacturers against each other, and managing to build a balanced/matched system where you're hearing the best of everything is just so frustratingly difficult that it's a lot easier to go the 'synergistic' route like Linn or just cut the component count down massively by going for an intergrated solution like Devialet. That said, one reason I left Linn was I felt the synergy had been lost in recent years. It was becoming fairly difficult to match components, and I felt some dissafisfaction with their power amps in particular, and speakers - the modern ones of which I don't really like. Akubariks are probably the latest I've heard (about 2-3 years ago?) and I was pretty impressed.
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