USB Regen from UpTone

[Hifi_swlon]

Wow, the war is raging on about the Regen over at 'Whats Best' forum!

All I can do is watch on in amazement as I wait for our fantastically efficient Customs/Post Office to get on with delivering mine.

[Antoine]

Haha, I've read it too and have even been stupid enough to make two posts in that topic. It's the classic subjectivist vs objectivist discussion thus far. Nothing to do with "science" yet which they aimed for.

[Hifi_swlon]

Haha, I've read it too and have even been stupid enough to make two posts in that topic. It's the classic subjectivist vs objectivist discussion thus far. Nothing to do with "science" yet which they aimed for.

Haha you're brave!

I've not read much on that site, and now I know why - I don't think I'll venture back in hurry (apart from to snoop on that thread for the amusement).

It didn't seem very scientific as despite the authors claims - the thread title had the word 'review' in it for a start which kind of sets the precedent.  Not sure if he has an axe to grind or what but it seems like the object was to show that it didn't work by any scientific means possible.  I've got a degree in Physics but no nothing about DAC design or electronics so wont chime in - but the way he dealt with any criticisms didn't seem like he was remotely a scientist.  He just came across more like an arrogant individual that likes an argument.

Still, it's entertaining.

I suppose at least I know I don't need to use my ears now to test it when mine comes - by his reasoning, I've already ben brainwashed into 'knowing' that ti works despite it 'doing nothing'.  We'll see….

[Hifi_swlon]

Finally, the Regen arrives!

Plugging it in cold out of the box didn't give any wow moment, but will report back when things have settled and have had time to listen/compare. I'm even more intrigued since the various 'wars' breaking out over the apparent 'scientific' proof that it does nothing other than perhaps add noise.

Will see what my ears find....

[Hifi_swlon]

Well.... This is an interesting one.

Have had the Regen powered up for two days.

It's hooked up with its supplied SMPS and hard adaptor into the Dev, using Guillaume's kindly loaned Audioquest Carbon USB cable. Standard dedicated Mac mini semi-optimised, and with internal ssd.  Roon in exclusive mode. No fancy power cables or dedicated mains.

I played music through it for over 24 hours continuous, listening on and off on Sunday. There was no wow moment for sure, but I had initially thought there was a subtle improvement, but then again I'd never left the D200 on and playing music (quietly) for over 24 hours before so I thought that might have been a factor.

Tonight I tried again on a very limited set of tracks, and did a small set of AB session of 'critical' listening. Nothing scientific - just me, eyes closed, on a few well known tracks one at a time, each time listening all the way through then again half way through swapped out removing the Regen (but keeping it powered while it was out of the chain). There is a bit if a delay switching over. Roon kindly remembers the paths through once both setups are saved, but at the height mines on the wall it's a faff to see the USB socket on the 200. Anyway, I did my best to do it quickly. On each occasion where i'd thought I'd heard extra details or 'smoothness' or 'tightening up of bass' or whatever, they turned out to be just the same when listening again with it removed. My guess is when I concentrate on listening, I hear subtle things I may miss otherwise, and that this might be mistaken for an 'improvement'.

I know the Dev doesn't use the 5v power so as I understand it all we're looking at is its alleged signal regenerating and impedance matching. My best conclusion after today's test is if it's doing something it's subtle. I didn't detect anything negative.

That seems to contradict a lot of other users, and now I'm hugely intrigued. My bias hopefully should be balanced as I've read that circa 1700 people think it makes an improvement, and also that people have measured that it does nothing useful.

I drew the same conclusion on the jitterbugs so some may say my ears/setup aren't up to it, and perhaps that's true, but I feel I can hear tiny changes in other situations.

So, because I'm really interested in this debate now, I've ordered a BOTW booster 6v linear ps (it was a previous model on sale) and will test when it arrives, as well as some more in the meantime if I get time.

I really hope it does give an improvement I can hear.   Will report back after the next wave. Maybe I'll be of a different opinion next time round.

[baddog]

So I have a Regen and a Devialet 400. Had the two integrated for quite some time. Decided I wanted to downsize a bit, so pulled the Regen out of the system, thinking it would not make any impact on the sound. Sadly it did and the Regen is still here.

A similar occurrence happened with my Silver Circle Audio 5, thought hey I don't need this anymore. Pulled it out, boxed it up ready to sell it. Turned on the system the next day, back in it went.

Where am I going with this? I find rather than trying to A/B by putting something in and out of my system, it is easier for me to add something to the system, get used to it for a while, then pull it out and see if it makes a positive or negative difference.

FWIW, YMMV.

My chain is Mac Mini ( 2012 model running El Capitan, Quad Core i7, 16 Gb memory, SSD drive ) running RoonServer to Regen via LH cable, to Devialet. All music on NAS or from Tidal. Using Wireless on the Mac Mini.

[Hifi_swlon]

….I find rather than trying to A/B by putting something in and out of my system, it is easier for me to add something to the system, get used to it for a while, then pull it out and see if it makes a positive or negative difference.

FWIW, YMMV.

I do agree with this. I plan to do a bit more of that over the coming days/weeks.

Before I started A/bing I let a small selection of well known tracks play with the regen out, I didn't hear any detrimental effects or feeling that something was 'worse'. But this was just a small window one evening.

I do think if something's meant to give a real improvement, it should be 'fairly' obvious when properly listening for it. There are so many positive things posted on CA about the device that there are a lot of pointers to clear improvements to listen for. In terms of what people are hearing there, I wonder what is due to the Regen's 5V vs the actual 'regenerating' of the signal.

Assuming I have time to listen, if after the next week or so I can't convince myself it's doing something useful, I'll gladly lend it to an established (and localish) member with a higher end system than me to see what they make of it.

[ogs]

….I find rather than trying to A/B by putting something in and out of my system, it is easier for me to add something to the system, get used to it for a while, then pull it out and see if it makes a positive or negative difference.

FWIW, YMMV.

I do agree with this.  I plan to do a bit more of that over the coming days/weeks.

Before I started A/bing I let a small selection of well known tracks play with the regen out, I didn't hear any detrimental effects or feeling that something was 'worse'. But this was just a small window one evening.  

I do think if something's meant to give a real improvement, it should be 'fairly' obvious when properly listening for it.  There are so many positive things posted on CA about the device that there are a lot of pointers to clear improvements to listen for.  In terms of what people are hearing there, I wonder what is due to the Regen's 5V vs the actual 'regenerating' of the signal.

Assuming I have time to listen, if after the next week or so I can't convince myself it's doing something useful, I'll gladly lend it to an established (and localish) member with a higher end system than me to see what they make of it.

This is rather strange, but of course not impossible. You may in fact already have very good USB transfer from your Mac Mini. I think I've noticed that there is less "wow" from Mac Mini users than others. In my case the Regen between an Intel NUC and 250 make a BIG difference... I still use a "green" Regen even if I also have the "amber" board. Using the AQVOX 5V supply, this works better with the "green". The SMPS that comes with Regen is not usable in my system at all. Maybe the BOTW will make a difference?

[jfp]

well I have read the 14 pages of this topic and those tests below.
http://www.audiostream.com/content/upton...aDYhzcj.97
http://www.audiostream.com/content/usb-a...YKBFI9Z.97

Audiostream test with Devialet would give an answer to the question of Regen to be efficiency or not. But they did not test D.
Our systems (Devialet mainly) are already quite good and I know that improvement is always a short one and sometimes does not exist at all (I tried the Norston on my previous Naim system and you had a 'wow' effect but nothing on Devialet even with the Q8 and very expensive Nordost cables).

It seems just a few ones on this board are convinced by the Regen.
But what was your previous configuration ? just a regular USB cable ? what software ?
Mac Mini or not as it seems the improvement is tiny with. Why by the way ?
would you say AIR sounds the same as a USB connection ? AIR is prefered by Devialet team themselves. And AIR would be beaten by Regen + JitterBug (as it seems both together is the right choice) ? Is Air beaten by totaldac usb cable only ?

lots of remaining questions.

[ogs]

I do not think a test of Regen with a Devialet amp at Audiostream would answer all your questions. You'll have to try it in your own system.

At first I used an ordinary USB cable and the short extension that comes with the Regen. SMPS power. Clear improvement. Then I got a 70cm Supra USB to use from my Intel NUC. I replaced the short extension with a 90degree hard adapter I made my self. I also use a AQVOX USB LPS. Works very well and sounds wonderful. I've tried JPLAY (Win Server 2012R2 on the NUC, Jplaystreamer. No further mods to the OS) and currently use MPD with upmpdcli on the same NUC. VoyageMPD latest. Both with MC21 DLNA server&DSP.
JPLAY/Jplaystreamer may sound a little better better, but the MPD solution is more stable. AIR? I honestly do not know. I never got any version of AIR to work and I have decided not to use energy on AIR before I am certain it is stable. I mean 100% reliable... Even then I may not use AIR as Devialet seems unwilling to release AIR for Linux (or maybe this is too difficult for the developers). AIR preferred by Devialet team? They made it so they have to!